Use of membrane with gravel drive

[The Family Fixer]

We have just had a new gravel drive and other landscaping to the front of the house. The contractor has not quite finished the job yet but Christmas intervened and now the boss is on holiday - we knew this would be the situation.

A couple of problems have become clear in the meantime.

The membrane is appearing under the gravel and also the edges of the membraneare sticking up at various places in the drive.

The membrane was laid on top of the base layer (sorry not sure of the right terms for these) and then the gravel laid directly on top. This was not as it was explained at the outset - they said they would put some more of the base layer type of stuff on the membrane and compact it, but when challenged on that, they said they were only going to do that if there was any left over.

The weather was very bad before Christmas and they were clearly running out of time - in fairness they say they are coming back to finalise (and compact and 'top up' the gravel among other things) everything at the end of the month, but before this I would like to know particularly about the situation with the membrane.

I have read the info elsewhere on the site about the use of/need for (or not as the case maybe). I could see info about membranes being laid at a much lower level but am not sure if the way they have done it is a complete no-no. If it is reasonable to lay it at the level they have done should it be pinned down in some way to prevent it sticking up at the edges of each sheet - this occurs at the edge of the drive and also in the middle of the drive where individual sheets end - not a good look!

There is also an area on the drive which had major pools of water after the recent rainfall - I am assuming this should have been ironed out when they were doing the sub layer.

I believe the company we are using are reputable and will resolve any issues, but it would be really helpful to me to know how this ought to be done before I talk to them.

Thanks in advance.

[msh paving]

the membrain should never be placed directly under the gravel, as it unsafe to walk on and driving in it will wheel spin,like marbles on concrete.
dig out,geotextile,sub-base 150mm is ideal for car traffic MOT type1 should be used,then the gravel,

what they have done is wrong,and not suitable for the job,
water laying is due to the type 1 not being laid flat and having bumps and low spots in it,

Don't pay them a penny till is is dug up and relaid correctly,
it will not last 6 weeks with the gravel on top of geotextile

MSH

[lutonlagerlout]

^^
non woven geotextile I.E. terram or multitrack should have been laid on the ground before the subbase was put in
its just plain wrong what they have done
LLL

[The Family Fixer]

Thanks for the replies - really helpful, but rather concerning .

Happy to take any more feedback if there is any.

[Tony McC]

Membrane beneath gravel top dressing is WRONG, but the problem is, the cost to put it right is quite high as the pillocks involved would have to remove at least 80-90mm of sub-base to ensure adequate cover for when the replacement membrane is installed at something like the correct depth. Consequently, there will be much bullshit about why they have done nowt wrong (in their eyes only!)

Also, standing water is a concern, especially on a newly-constructed open gravel area. The opportunity to install land drainage was never better than when they had the ground open, so why wasn't it done?

[Dave_L]

Sounds like a rush job, badly done!

[The Family Fixer]

Thanks again for all the feedback.

I was considering the best route to put this right and achieve a positive outcome all round and wondering about the benefit of the membrane at all.

While reading other sections of your helpful site I came across the area dedicated to 'membranes' and concluded (maybe incorrectly) that there did not seem to be much benefit at all for a membrane in our situation. I thought the benefit was weed prevention, but can now see that that is very minimal.

I thought it might be easier, and no apparent downside, to get rid of the membrane all together, ensure that the sub base is laid evenly to get rid of the dips causing the pool of water and put the gravel on top. Am I being naiive? Any thoughts?

[rimexboy]

I'm not a contractor but all I will say is this.

If you have asked a contractor to do a job and its not fit for the purpose you inform them and give them time to put it right, if they choose not to for whatever reason, you get another contractor to tell you how much it is to do the job correctly and pass that on to the first contractor and inform him if its not done then you have no choice but to withhold any payment owed or made until its been done.

I'm sorry but the guys on here do these sort of jobs day in day out, they know there stuff, so simply inform the contractor of your findings and also ask them what they wish to do to rectify it.

Let us know what they say they will do please

Also what area are you in as one of the guys on here may be able to take a look or help in some way.

Thanks Simon

[Pablo]

I completely agree that no membrane should be used under the gravel but it's unlikely to be the contractors fault if you have bad puddles after severe rain. If you had requested drainage or it was included in the quote then yes they should sort it otherwise it's your problem not theirs and it would be unreasonable to expect them to install additional drainage to something that usually doesn't require it at their cost. Get them to take the membrane out which will take no time at all and top the gravel up to 30-40mm no deeper. If the base pumps or sinks any fix will be covered by a workmanship guarantee and if a membrane was priced to go under the base get them to take it off the bill and leave it at that and see if it lasts.

[Dave_L]

I think that is quite a fair 'solution' Pablo - and very well put too

[GB_Groundworks]

did they consolidate (whacker/roll) the gravel after install as well? i hate deep gravel its a pain in the arrrrrrse, was it tony on here who knew an old boy who said only have a gravel drive if you have a man to rake it every day. like the big stately homes do