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local patios and driveway
Posts: 1568
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Location: Gatwick
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Post: # 64801Post local patios and driveway

damn, i got raped on this forum for having a few darts on a driveway i posted pictures of. im not knocking anyones work its all very nice but there seems to be lots of ass kissing here..


like the murphys.. im not bitter... :blush:

London Stone Paving
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Location: Surrey
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Post: # 64803Post London Stone Paving

Not a big fan of the squaring off kits either. It just looks like a square plonked in the middle of the patio. Circles look way better without the kit

Nice portfolio of work pablo

lutonlagerlout
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Posts: 15184
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 12:20 am
Location: bedfordshire

Post: # 64805Post lutonlagerlout

local patios and driveways wrote:damn, i got raped on this forum for having a few darts on a driveway i posted pictures of. im not knocking anyones work its all very nice but there seems to be lots of ass kissing here..


like the murphys.. im not bitter... :blush:
take note mate
most clued up lads post pictures of the finished jobs
i like to post warts and all pictures,but its easy to find fault that way
cant make an omlette without breaking eggs
:;):
LLL
ps i feel that i have learned a lot over the last 7 years i have used PE and BC
no more clouds of dust on our jobs
inboard cutting
screed rails
but we have to be hard on each other
keep the standards up IYKWIM
cheers
"what,you want paying today??"

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lutonlagerlout
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Location: bedfordshire

Post: # 64806Post lutonlagerlout

i thought with tegula darts are unavoidable in some spots?
when they are on a 200 by 100 drive they dont need to be there
re:squaring off kits i agree with all that has been said,on the whole they dont look right
i do find cutting internal arcs labourious and for that reason i discourage circles in paving,as a stand alone feature for a table and chairs they look nice,but not plonked in the middle of a patio
LLL :)
"what,you want paying today??"

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Pablo
Posts: 1990
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:49 pm
Location: N/Ireland

Post: # 64810Post Pablo

lutonlagerlout wrote:i thought with tegula darts are unavoidable in some spots?
when they are on a 200 by 100 drive they dont need to be there

True although there are ways of getting around it but they look crap and are only really needed for high impact areas for large vehicles. You can avoid most of them if your using a 3 size mix but tbh I've yet to see a dart fail and I feel it looks better to continue the pattern with darts rather than mix it up and throw in something that looks out of place and isn't neccessary. With darts I always throw a bit more sand into the hole then knock them home with a maul and they never move. I feel it's unfair to pull someone up on darts if they've been done well because although it's not best practice they do offer the best compromise between that and best looks. And if a dart is highly unlikely to fail why would you bother doing it any other way and ruining the pattern/bond. This may be a bit controversial given the company on here so I'm filling a sandbag as we speak and getting ready for the flak. :laugh:




Edited By Pablo on 1307816345
Can't see it from my house

local patios and driveway
Posts: 1568
Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 9:58 pm
Location: Gatwick
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Post: # 64812Post local patios and driveway

i agree, i always look at darts on old driveways and ive never seen one thats sunk.

pickwell paving
Posts: 190
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:27 pm
Location: lincs

Post: # 64815Post pickwell paving

Darts should be avoided where possible because they don't conform to british standards of laying/cutting in, most commercial jobs they would be picked up by the clark of works and have to be redone, we've done MOD work before and they won't accept anything smaller than half a block. It draws your eye to them if you ask me when you see a block cut along its length or a tiny piece the size of penny, and in my opinion any paving contractor should have a block splitter as part of their tool kit.
Paving and Groundworks in Lincolnshire

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lutonlagerlout
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Location: bedfordshire

Post: # 64817Post lutonlagerlout

i have done it both ways and can see both sides
to my eye continuing the pattern looks best
but it aint british standard
however i cant make it work with tegula ???
LLL
"what,you want paying today??"

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pickwell paving
Posts: 190
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:27 pm
Location: lincs

Post: # 64819Post pickwell paving

The reason so many people put slips and darts in their paving is because there is a lack of skilled labour on a block splitter, its so much easier to lay the paving then run the stihl saw round at the end regardless of how it should be done. Slips and darts are the block paving equivalent of spot bedding which is frowned upon on this forum and rightly so, so how come when people talk about how to do things correctly the same doesn't apply to cutting in? :rock:
Paving and Groundworks in Lincolnshire

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Pablo
Posts: 1990
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:49 pm
Location: N/Ireland

Post: # 64824Post Pablo

I agree that they shouldn't be used in commercial work and we always do so where possible but Mrs Smith at 63 drives a car not a tank and the heaviest vehicle on her driveway will be a DHL van every christmas so a dart will not fail in that instance and it does look a lot better. I strongly disagree that the reason for pavers not using a splitter is because of lack of skill. I use both and there are a lot of cuts that a splitter can't do like curves and nips off the ends also there are a lot of block types that don't split well regardless of how much skill you have. Personally I have my men trained to a standard where they only have to look at a lot of cuts and then freehand them with the saw or just mark one end of the block and buzz it. That patio I did on friday in the tools thread took about 45 mins to cut in and trim on friday using just such a method and there's not a single bad cut in it. I also disagree that darts and slips are the equivilent of spot bedding they're not but poor subbase and bedding installation is and thats the reason for 99.9% of all driveway failures.
I do respect your integrity on this issue though and wouldn't fault any paver who tries to avoid darts like yourself it is the reccommended standard I just don't like the look of it and feel it's overkill in most domestic applications.
Can't see it from my house

lutonlagerlout
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Posts: 15184
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 12:20 am
Location: bedfordshire

Post: # 64825Post lutonlagerlout

pickwell paving wrote:The reason so many people put slips and darts in their paving is because there is a lack of skilled labour on a block splitter, its so much easier to lay the paving then run the stihl saw round at the end regardless of how it should be done. Slips and darts are the block paving equivalent of spot bedding which is frowned upon on this forum and rightly so, so how come when people talk about how to do things correctly the same doesn't apply to cutting in? :rock:
i would say 70mm of sand and 50mm sub base is a better metaphor for spot bedding
back to my point,i have found it unavoidable with tegula especially herringbone tegula
LLL
"what,you want paying today??"

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cookiewales
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Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:30 am
Location: york work anywhere where the stone takes me
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Post: # 64826Post cookiewales

well boys i laid some 200 150 60 bardon cbp last week ground was bad so i mixed 4 to1 grit sand cement and laid them in rows like my setts washed in the kiln dried next day top job will post photos ps it was a extra between niegbours so no budget :D
Originalstonepaving.com

The very best in natural stone paving in new and reclaimed materials
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jonnyboyentire
Posts: 320
Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 7:09 pm
Location: uk

Post: # 64828Post jonnyboyentire

As promised some pics of the planting we did up on Saturday, took a couple of helpers along :D so they can see how I pay for their mobiles/laptops etc lol. Got about 250 bedders and herbaceous plants done in around a couple of hours. Just adding to what we've done there in the last year and a half.


There was effectively nothing in the garden but grass and a couple of badly placed trees when we rolled up.
Oh, and yes, as an aside :cool: all the paving and walling was done by us too. Replacing dabbed buff 600sq developer specials!!!
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full bed only - spot and dabs are the scourge!!

jonnyboyentire
Posts: 320
Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 7:09 pm
Location: uk

Post: # 64829Post jonnyboyentire

Found some more pics same site earlier in year with better camera !!!

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full bed only - spot and dabs are the scourge!!

Pablo
Posts: 1990
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:49 pm
Location: N/Ireland

Post: # 64830Post Pablo

You've a good eye for plants Johnny they sit very well with the house style. Any chance of some shots of the hardscaping I like the look of it. Also I'm trying to get hold of some stone Urns just like those for my own house they'd look great on some pillars I love em.
Can't see it from my house

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