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Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 6:08 pm
by r44flyer
Not much to do with paving but I'm sure there's enough knowledge here to help.
Our house is of 1950s construction and has steel framed windows which need replacing with double glazing. An easy solution would be to cut the internal framing out of the outer box section frame, and screw the new frames into the box section and pop in the glazing. This would give quite a 'thick' looking frame and it's probably more of a bodge.
Preferably the old frame would be completely cut out back to the brick. However, are these types of windows likely to use the steel box section frame as a lintel, or will there be a separate lintel? ie. if I remove the frame is there nothing else supporting the brickwork above? Or, is hacking the plaster off to look the only way to really tell? I had hoped to avoid any unnecessary damage.
Thanks.
Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 6:16 pm
by msh paving
I'm shure mr lout will be along soon, he is experianced in this type off problem MSH 
Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 6:43 pm
by lutonlagerlout
sounds like you have crittall type window crittall
generally speaking houses this age will have a boot type concret lintel at the rear and some angle iron at the front
but it will look best if the whole of the old frame comes out
take some pictures and post them and i will give you the SP
cheers
Mr.Lout
Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:06 pm
by r44flyer
I've read crittal somewhere else as a likely candidate. I'll get some photos, hopefully tomorrow.
Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 6:53 pm
by irishpaving
They are some clear pics for a phone.... That bar on top of the frame looks like it is the lintel. That brick has heavy mortar joints but you will need LLL to give the sp on this one
Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 7:28 pm
by r44flyer
I thought that might've been a lintel, but it doesn't appear to enter the brick. I figured it was a drip.
The phone's 8.1MP (Sony Ericsson W995). I'm amazed at the quality.
Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:24 pm
by lutonlagerlout
they are indeed crittalls, BTW it isnt an art shoot
nice square on straight ahead pics is what we need :;):
all those angled shots make me dizzy :O
no sign of a lintel but the concrete may have been poured in situ with mesh or ties coming out the back of the bricks
if you try and drill a hole in the wall above the window chances are it will be a boot lintel ,solid concrete and very heavy
the only way you can find out for sure whats there is to take the window out
how many courses of brickwork are above that window?
cheers LLL
Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 9:22 pm
by r44flyer
Sorry about the photos, I just wanted to photograph the corners to give more detail, and snapped the ones in most sunlight at the time. The bottom one's the wrong way up somehow, no wonder your head's spinning! 
Best I drill a few holes then and see if I hit a lintel.
There are 15 courses from top of ground floor windows to sills of first floor windows. Let's have a photo overload and have one of the frontage from Google StreetView!...
Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:19 am
by mickg
take a photo like the first photo you posted but hold the lens above the hinge so we can see where the window meets the brickwork in the top right hand corner of the frame
also get an old screwdriver or something what you can use to scrape the mortar or paint from the brickwork/window in that top right hand corner of the frame just to see if the steel is in fact a lintel and is built into the brickwork or it butts to the face of the brick and is only a drip above the frame
its been many many years since I removed a house full of steel framed windows but i do recall they are held in place with steel straps what are fixed to the inside wall which looking at your photos are behind the internal timbers what are all round the window
if you remove theses timbers you should be able to see how they are fixed
Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:12 am
by r44flyer
Thanks mick, i'll have a poke and see what I come up with. By the way, there are no timbers around the windows, it's all steel box section, all part of the frame.
Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:17 am
by mickg
on photo 3 and 4 on the inside it looks like timber window linings up both side and across the top of the window and then the wallpaper, are you saying this is metal too ?
Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:57 am
by r44flyer
Yup. You can see in photo 2, where I've tried to mount the blue blind on the frame, thinking it was wood, the bit jumped and chipped the paint to reveal metal. The blind is now mounted to the brickwork instead.
