Re-pointing brick steps - Best mix

[Wheelyjon]

Built in the 1850s my garden is largely walled (Suffolk reds). I have found that a cement/lime/sand mix of 1:1:8 matches quite well, but is it strong enough? There are also many brick steps, I understand that you should not use lime underground, but is it ok to use it on steps that sit on the ground? Any suggestions for mix here.

Thanks
Wheelyjohn

[lutonlagerlout]

that's weak for steps John

I would go for 3:1 :1 / 3 sand ,1 cement,and 1 lime

the lime being there purely for colour and workability

LLL

[sy76uk]

I always use white cement instead of lime. I use the following for pointing-1 red sand, 1 yellow sand, 1 sharp, 1 white cement. Goes off rock hard and is a really nice colour.

[lutonlagerlout]

where do i find red sand darn sarf then sy?
never seen it
LLL

[sy76uk]

Red building sand Tony. Don't know if it's just a regional thing as the only sand I've used in your neck of the woods is sharp.

It's full of clay and very stodgey, Lovely stuff for pointing brickwork but if your looking for a lime type morter then I use the mix above just because it's a very strong and nice to work with mix that dries white but when it's damp has a very slight peachy colour.

[lutonlagerlout]

I thought all sand was yellow/orange until I saw some pictures from oop north
LLL

[Wheelyjon]

3:1:1. Would that not be too strong to use with soft red bricks,?

[lutonlagerlout]

if the bricks are that soft they will be no good for steps?
LLL

[Wheelyjon]

They've been there since the 1850s and yes, they are in places very worn and eroded, but this is a case of repair and preservation, not rebuilding with new bricks, hence my question, what mix to re-point old Suffolk reds

[lutonlagerlout]

wheely

back in the day cement was super expensive ,so they used lime mortar which was quicklime mixed with sand and then buried for a year or two to cure before it was used

I have worked on houses older than yours and the way it worked was that when the lime was fired all the CO2 was burnt out of it

over the years the CO2 bonds back with it and effectively turns the lime mortar back into chalk/sand

sadly with acid rain,frost etc this becomes eroded

I have used parex historical lime mortar which contains no cement at all but that is above DPC

IMHO if you use it below DPC or in steps it will need to be fairly strong

if you use 8:1:1 it will look very bucolic but may not last that long
also if you want to keep it real use a coarser grade of sand that what is currently called building sand

I know there is a school of thought that says the mortar should be weaker than the bricks but you run the risk of the steps failing
LLL

[Tony McC]

where do i find red sand darn sarf then sy?

I'll drop off a bag for you the next time I'm passing. Makes a lovely pointing mortar!

[KLS]

where do i find red sand darn sarf then sy?
never seen it
LLL

IN B&Q Tony, thats a red type sand, I think from staffs way, When people want thats purple gravel thats about £80-90 a tonne we get it from B&Q as its there normal gravel so only 40 a tonne instead.

[Mikey_C]

despite being a national company B&Q source sand (and I imagine other bulky items) locally, so the sand down south is yellow and the gravel your standard yellow brown etc. mix. That is of course right down south!!

[lutonlagerlout]

we are the dirty south mikey
you are the deep south
I have had sand from b and q before and it looked like they found it on a beach somewhere
LLL