The Brew Cabin

Posted: **Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:08 pm**

Hi,

Has anyone attempted pattern imprinted concrete before (I mean those guys who don't normally do it for a living)?

I realise this job is probably best done by the proffesionals but I fancy attempting myself at my own house.

I intend on doing the whole way round my house (front/side/back) getting rid of the plain concrete patio at the side and the grass/mud front and back.
I have concreted a few times before but I am not in the trade.

I'm probably planning on getting some training from a pic company - would this be a good idea?

how did it go?
any tips?
did you train with anyone first?
if yes, what company did you use?
where did you buy your kit?
or did you rent it?

thanks

Posted: **Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:24 pm**

don't do it

pic is bad enough when done by professionals and experienced people.

pick something better blocks or flags

Posted: **Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:45 pm**

thanks for the reply GB, I will certainly listen to what you are saying

a few of my neighbours have this sort of paving and they are very happy, though I have seen photos of nightmare jobs

I 100% realise I am not a pro - so can understand why you would say don't in that respect, obviously there is no way I can account for years of experiance/skill

However I would still like to attept it myself on my own property, maybe a small area round the back first so I can ut it up if all goes pear shaped... my GF father is an ex paver, he did a lot of block/slabs and flags himself so I will have a bit of guidence + plus maybe some training from a pic company

not doubting what you say but can you expand a bit please... I've read the pro's and con's via article on this site etc
would really appreciate further input, cheers mate

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:17 am**

don't bother,there is so much to learn,which you wont learn on a course off 1 day,its alot different to concrete laying,
you will need all the tools a full set will cost you 6-7 hundred quid,then renting the mats+buying the sealer,antique release,you will need at least 4 people in a gang to place the concrete,float in the colour powder,tamp the mats in,its up to you but i would not say its a good idea,to much to lose,the concrete alone is high cement content with the price rise its around Â£90ish a cube

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:01 am**

PIC is NOT a DIY job. Concrete just doesn't give you the time to eff about trying to get your mats in the right position and there is so much about the finishing of concrete that can only be learned from experience.

Unless you have a couple of years minimum of experience, it WILL turn out wrong, and it WILL cost you as much again to jack-hammer out the abortion that you will be left facing.

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:43 pm**

Please don't do it - why go thru a horrendous time & effort - just to lay a hideous layer of concrete, pretending to be something else - (let alone the drainage issues) - there are some fantastic stone products out there - when you've finished - you'll have something to be really proud of - and then post the photies on here !!
All the best.
ps - surely your GF would advise with the laying of slabs/pavers etc?

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:26 pm**

Tony McC wrote:PIC is NOT a DIY job. Concrete just doesn't give you the time to eff about trying to get your mats in the right position and there is so much about the finishing of concrete that can only be learned from experience.

Unless you have a couple of years minimum of experience, it WILL turn out wrong, and it WILL cost you as much again to jack-hammer out the abortion that you will be left facing.

thanks for all the replys
I know it's not a good idea, not a DIY job but I have a knack of getting things done not to blow my own trumpet but I have just installed a sign on my salon and saved Â£3k doing it myself.
Yes it was hard, not done without error but all in all I get a sense of achievement out of attempting these things.
At the end of it, if it all goes wrong I only have myself to blame.

tony -

No I don't have that much experiance so I am concerned, but as much as it might look like I am not listening to everyone, I still fancy having a go.
I could practice in he garden as it's a total mess ATM before I go for the proper thing (garden will need raising at the back so I could use the waste).

The time you have and the speed you have to lay the mats is the thing that bothers me most.
From barrowing it in, rollering, tamping, floating etc to stamping how long do you have to play with?

I've seen the pro's do large sections with a lot of people on the job but do the small crews work smaller sections?

I do have experiance on hand so to speak but the guy (my GF's father) is to old to be doing back breaking work himself so he would be with me but not doing it himself.
I would have another 3 lads with, so 5 of us.

thanks for the advice guys, all input welcome good or bad

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:34 pm**

Forgive me JohnnyO - here's my input - yeeeucgh....!
(sound of vomitting from a far corner)

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:41 pm**

get a cement mixer put a wet mix in then add some bricks, stand in front of said mixer (with your ppe on) and then tear up twenty pound notes as you are splattered with concrete for a similar feeling as to what you are going to do? pic looks crap at the best of times, its slippy and fades and wears quickly back to concrete.

save your self the hassle and do it in something easier and nicer, you can still do it yourself and feel empowered but with better finished product.

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:58 pm**

John - I can't even offer you any guidance on the timings: that is part of the skill of a professional concrete finisher. The 'perfect print point' for a concrete slab will depend on (amongst other things)....

<ul>
<li> ambient temperature
<li> ambient humidity
<li> sun or shade?
<li> slump of concrete
<li> cement content of concrete
<li> type/brand of colour hardener used
<li> presence/absence of DPM
<li> amount of trowelling applied to concrete
<li> type of aggregate used in concrete
</ul>

...this is something that can only be learned by experience. Undertaking small test panels is nowhere near good enough to prepare anyone for a PIC installation.

I would put your chance of successfully installing an aesthetically and structurally acceptable PIC surface at less than 5%. Any money you save by DIYing will be lost in what it then costs to have a professional installer come around, jack-hammer out what you laid, cart it all away, and install a decent surface in its place.

This is not a case of an industry protecting its patch, deterring DIYers or anything like that. I'm the first to encourage DIYers to have a go at laying a flagstone patio or a block paved driveway, as evidenced by the website, but PIC is simply not a DIY job. I'd be failing my integrity if I let you think, for one nano-second, that PIC was suitable for diy: it's not!

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:50 pm**

John, I had a 5 year stint doing P.I.C from the late 80s to early 90s.
Althuogh i really enjoyed doing the work, my opinion of it now is still the same as it was back then.
It belongs in shopping malls, holiday resorts and seaside promonades.
It looks nothing like the real thing that it was designed to imitate.
After its been sealed it looks like plastic, compared to some real flags.

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:31 pm**

it's a resounding don't do it!!!
OK, gonna spend some more time thinking... nothings planned and I'm not in any rush.

In the mean time, can anyone suggest a better surface?
It's for front back and side of house... whatever I do I want to seal it and keep it maintenance free as possible.
What would be an alternative to the typical PIC platinum grey or dark bluey grey ashlar stone pattern?

Posted: **Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:37 pm**

If you want to have a go yourself then maybe think about block paving if you follow the site then it's within your bounds and budget.

Posted: **Sun Jan 18, 2009 10:22 am**

If you must DIY, then block paving is the obvious option. Given you're in Manchestoh and you wany a grey-ish ashlar stone look, I'd suggest Slate Roma from Tobermore. It is a multi-grey with three block sizes that give an interesting non-coursed appearance not too dissimilar to ashlar stone...

...once it's been laid and allowed to weather-in for a few months, it can be sealed and you have a surface that is just about as low-maintenance as it's possible to be.

Posted: **Sun Jan 18, 2009 12:58 pm**

Im a big fan of Roma too. Expect to pay around Â£16.50 per m2 delivered but plus vat.

The Brew Cabin

Pattern imprinted concrete - (diy job)