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Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:01 pm
by mrs noah
Hello! does anyone know how to calculate the amount of runoff from a stable yard, 120 sq m, which is halfway down a very rainy sloping 5 acre field. The rain will flow over the yard and down the hill, which will then enter the watercourse and run into peoples cellars and back gardens. There is no access to the foul sewer, a tank will be needed.
Many thanks for reading this, I hope you can advise
Mrs noah
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 6:12 pm
by lutonlagerlout
seek and ye shall find
mrs noah
be aware that on days like today soakaways do not always work
one at work is full to the brim after todays deluge
more digging tomorrow 
LLL
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:23 pm
by mrs noah
Thanks for that, LLL, I think that according to the environment agency, this runoff is contaminated and has to be collected in a sealed tank and taken away by a certified effluent collector. There would be a risk of contamination to the field drains etc. if it soaked away underground. By the way, I am living in the cottages at the foot of the field and our local planning guy hasn't asked the developer for any drainage plans. Mr. Noah is busy building his ark and I am getting all the kids tetanus shots.
Thanks for any help!
Mrs. Noah
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 8:02 pm
by Dave_L
Why would a stable yard have contaminated runoff? (Piss and shit, I know....)
Surely if the horses were out in the fields, it would be no different?
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:08 pm
by mrs noah
According to the environment agency all stable washings, effluent etc. is contaminated and must not enter a clean water drain. The yard is a catchment area and will mix with the rain and possibly get into the drains. The idea of the tank stops the stable owner from committing an offence. This is what I am being told! Even black bales containing hay must not leak into a watercourse and must not be nearer than 10 metres to a field drain. The stable roof of this development of course is catching clean runoff and this is on the plan to be seperately piped into a pre-victorian field drain which floods and runs into our cottages! Our planning officer likes us!
Mrs Noah
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:13 pm
by mrs noah
I've just found this info-
http://www.netregs.gov.uk/netregs....1030480
How the heck can I argue what size of tank will be safe!
Thanks for any help
Mrs Noah
from the wet and windy Pennines
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:45 pm
by Dave_L
Sheesh! Now what is the difference between the horses out in the field versus them in a stable? Wherever they take a leak, it's gonna end up in the same place!
Oh well, glad my daughter isn't into horses (yet) 
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:02 pm
by mrs noah
Just a bit of background here, but we got the stables turned down twice at planning (I've nothing against horses) but we live in a steep place and our houses are 200yrs old with unmapped drains. We know the worst will happen! The inspector (appeal) gave consent BUT with conditions, like drainage. Our local planning officer doesn't like us 'cos we objected and made his life hard, and he doesn't know about the runoff rules. He now says he doesn't have to consult anyone.
MRs Noah, ark not built yet
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:43 pm
by lutonlagerlout
that's why builders never buy houses at the bottom of a hill
TBH if there are planning constraints regarding drainage then just ask your planning enforcement officer to check they have been adhered to,
but its better to get on with the neighbour than not,you do not want to get labelled a NIMBY
do you?
LLL :;):
Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:46 am
by mrs noah
I know what you are saying, LLL. There isn't really any flat land here (imagine Royston Vasey) and the field drains usually cope well with the rain if they are not messed about with. It is up to the Planning Manager to approve the drainage system and I was looking for some way to write to him and urge him not to approve without taking expert advice. He wants to direct the roof runoff (L shaped 36 ft x 29 ft) into one field drain which we know will be overwhelmed with water. Suppose my local councillor can call in the engineers from the council? The planning manager has emailed a neighbour to say that his opnion won't change even after consultation.
Thanks for letting me moan, GREAT SITE,
Mrs noah, ark now full of kids and animals
Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:45 pm
by IanMelb
There should be a planning committee which oversees decisions of Planning Officers it often contains Ward Councillors. The committee are usually the first in line for appeals. Talk to your Councillor and ask him if he knows anyone on the committee...
Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:48 pm
by mrs noah
I think you have given me the right idea. There is a group of neighbours who now want to see this thing done properly. We know a Councillor who should take this seriously, and that is what we will do. Prevention is better than cure.
Mrs Noah setting sail.........
Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 8:42 pm
by lutonlagerlout
why dont you and all the other villagers get big coats with pointed hoods on,and pitchforks and sickles and go up to yonder farm and start dancing round a big fire and beating drums and humming
you know summat like " the wicker man"
once they realise whats happening they will jump in the audi and speed off never to return!! 
but realistically speak to your planning control officer
cheers LLL
Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:28 am
by mrs noah
We do that anyway, but only on a full moon! I've only got one goat now, I sacrificed the other one last night.
Thanks for that LLL, I have seen the formula for working out the size of a soakaway Vol = A × (rainfall rate/3000) but is there one for calulating the size of a sealed tank? 120sq m area.
Thanks
Mrs Noah
Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:12 pm
by lutonlagerlout
ok well lets say hes going to use or empty the water tank once a quarter
in my part of the world avg. rainfall is 600 mm per year (approx 1970-2000)
so area is 120 m times 150/3000 = 6 m3 assuming you live in bedfordshire and he empties the tank once every 3 months
but surely not all the water will run down the hill?
some must soak in
a photo would be handy but to be honest i think you are worried about nothing,if the hill is that bad it will flood during heavy rain anyway
sadly that is due to weather and geography
regards LLL 