Page 1 of 1
Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:41 pm
by lancashire lass
we moved in our house 2 yrs ago. it is 3ft below the main road and has steep driveway. also, our back garden is lower than the house either side and those sat directly behind us. all in all were doomed!!! the sewerage drain is only set about a foot below the flags and often gets over laden with surface water when raining. we have been in touch with council........wont do anything about it.
a month after moving in the garden was flooded, the drains went and we resulted in the house being flooded. we have since dug a huge hole at the back of the garden were excess water collects and we have a pump running in bad weather to drain off the water. today its took 14hrs to drain everyone elses into ours and its still running.(its only a small pump. the others are too quick for the job)
the garden is 80% clay soil and we are at our wits end. we are frightened when we are away on holiday or out for the day if it rains. it seems the problems ours and everyone else doesnt bother 
what can we do for the best? is there a short term solution until we have time and money to do the garden?
the house is continually standing in water in winter and were frightened what this can do to the house.
PLEASE PLEASE HELP. 
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 4:56 pm
by dig dug dan
perhaps tony can guide here, but there is a company near me called hd drilling services who do deep drilling and can install soakaways using this method as they drill into the pourus ground beneath Having said that, it depends on the water table.
Are you in a valley?
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 5:30 pm
by lancashire lass
no not in a valley but i know years ago there was a lot of farm land around here. when the fire brigade pumped us out two years ago it took them 4 hrs to get rid of the water and they said our garden is possibly getting around 10-15 gardens worth of rain with it being the lowest point. i think its made it worse as at least 3 of the houses have just had stones laid in the garden and the turf took up as they are older people and dont want the work
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:57 pm
by de wynters
another option could be to buy a larger pump which has a float switch incorporated into it, when the hole fills with water the float rises and the pump starts, when the pump has pumped nearly all the wate it will drop and turn itself off. theoretically you could leave the pump on 24/7 and no more worries.
(unless you have a power cut as well, then abandon ship!!!!)
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 11:33 pm
by lancashire lass
thanks. that sounds like a good option. i think sometimes like this week when the weathers bad, you worry non stop and in summer you dont bother! imagine selling our house----- we would have to have potential buyers round on a dry day!!!:)
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:51 pm
by danensis
Presumably this issue has not arisen overnight? Have there been changes in the area, or new houses built?
According to an answer Tony gave to my query (See "Hardstanding" below) building control should be involved when people are replacing soil with hardstanding. Have you talked to the Building Control people, or the local water authority?
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:55 pm
by danensis
Another thought - who is paying for the electricity to pump this water away. If you take on responsibility for draining your neighbours' gardens, then they could have a legal case against you if, for any reason (say pump failure), you fail to carry out that duty.
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:08 pm
by lancashire lass
the neighbours dont give a stuff! it automatically runs into ours whether our pump is on or not. if we dont have it working its our house that gets flooded if it rises that high again. i had to pay for the hire of a pump last year when it rose to door level.
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:17 pm
by lancashire lass
our house was built in the 50's. new estates have been built all round us in the past three years. we have an idea thia is half the problem. my grandma lived in this house for 30 years and never had these problems. the council said the main drains in the street cant cope with the amount of water from all the new builds over the last years but they arent in a position to dig up the roads and put in multi million pound pipes for me! that is exactly what they said.the other thing, is that the sewerage drain in our drive (which we have two. one at the top and bottom) takes rain water and sewerage from my house and adjoining neighbour and the semi on the other side and their adjoining neighbour. i dont think the thing is big enough for that. also the council said that in terrential conditions when the drain is at bursting point, i should go and ask them all to turn off washing machines and showers etc to try and help! stuck somewhere between a rock and a hard place!
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:09 pm
by flowjoe
If the water in your garden is the result of a combined sewer (foul/storm) surcharging then that is a health issue and the local authority have no choice but to find a solution, if it is sewage then you would probably know by the delights floating around in it but if in doubt get the environmental health out to take a sample for analysis.
I suspect it is probably storm water run off from the gardens if so then something has changed to cause the problem, as danensis says building works in the area may have disturbed something such as a culvert, more likely is that a land drain has silted up over the years and blocked.
The trouble with this kind of job is knowing how much to spend on investigation before taking action by installing new drainage or a pump, if the sewers cant cope as they are then you have little hope of running a gravity drain to them, pumps work well but require maintenance and use plenty of electric and sometimes they don’t work at all if theirs a power cut or a fuse blows.
The first job is to establish where the water comes from, a simple water analysis will tell you if its foul, storm or potable water if the environmental health or UU wont fund it then it should cost about £70.
If it contains e.coli (foul) scream from your ridge tiles at anyone at the town hall who will listen.
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 2:09 pm
by danensis
If new houses have been built without adequate provision for disposal of water then that is clearly an issue for the planning department at your local council. You need to ask them why planning permission was granted if the drains were inadequate. The answer was probably containing in a plain brown envelope somewhere, but they're not going to admit to that, so you may end up asking your local councillor to investigate. If he or she was on the planning committee, this may not be a particularly productive avenue, so you could then get your solicitor to ask the same question.
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 4:47 pm
by Tony McC
My understanding is that the LA, as agents f the water authority in your area, are responsible for safe disposal of foul water from your property - after all, they hold out their hand for the council tax each year, which includes a chunk of money for sewage.
Yours is a combined system serving a number of properties, so, any problem upstream of the main sewer is a shared responsibility between you and the neighbours, while anything downstream is the responsibility of the LA and/or the water board.
It seems from what you've told us that the problem is worst when the main sewer is running at full bore which results in a surcharge on your property. I'm fairly sure this falls within the remit of the LA, whether they have the money for big new sewers or not. They cannot compromise environmental health on budgetary grounds.
If you were able to show that the surcharge was foul (as in the test mentioned by FlowJoe) and that there as no blockage or breakage in the pipework up to the point where it joins the main sewer, then the LA would have an obligation to take some action that would remove the health risk. Now: this may not be the big new sewer that's needed, but they would have to do summat, and they would have to be able to show it was practical. However, you may well need a <spit> lawyer to help you "persuade" the council to see things your way.
Returning to the problem with land drainage, given you're sat on clay in the local low spot, your only viable option would be to have sand drain constructed. This is essentially a core drilled through the earth to whatever depth is required to hit a permeable strata. The core is then lined with a pipe or backfilled with clean granular material and provides the outfall for your surface and groundwater. In some circumstances, even this is not feasible because of local geomorphology and water table levels, but a site survey would soon establish whether it was a goer or not. Relying on a pumped rising main is impractical not just because of the costs, but because the existing sewer system is incapable of functioning with the cuurrent load - forcing water pumped from your garden into that sewer will simply increase the volume of surcharge bubbling up from the gullies.
So - a sand drain, if possible, or a big new sewer if nowt else seems practical.
