The Brew Cabin

Posted: **Sat May 25, 2019 3:30 pm**

Hi Folks,

I've one problem flag right in the middle of my patio of Silver granite 900 x 600 flags. There are two big plastic rodding points and rather than cut round them, they are low enough that I can lay a single flag over the top, which I have done. It looks great and saves showing the ugly plastic in the middle of my uniform patio.

The problem is that as the flag needs to be lift-able at all times, so the rodding point can be accessed, so I've laid this flag on sand (all the rest is on a full mortar bed). The result is the flag stays wetter longer than the rest as it sucks up moisture from the wet sand below. It's moves slightly when you stand on it, as the bed is not completely solid. I've not done sealing and jointing yet, but this means when I do the jointing it will possibly break up with the movement.

I'm considering two options.

1) Paint SBR slurry on the back of the flag, I should have done this previously, let it dry and hope this forms a moisture barrier, then just seal and joint it along with the rest of the patio.

2) Take the sand out and put a full mortar bed, lay the flag, but then lift it and let the mortar dry. The sit the flag on the solid mortar, so it isn't stuck down. Then seal and joint to hold in place.

Any advice on how best to proceed?

Posted: **Sat May 25, 2019 6:01 pm**

Buy a rodding eye inset manhole that you can lay slabs into.
What you ard trying to do wont ever work , how will you joint up the gaps and have it removable?

Posted: **Sat May 25, 2019 8:37 pm**

Thanks DDD, Ideally I'd have used a rodding eye manhole cover, but they're too deep. I only have 15mm from the top of slab level to the rodding point level, had to grind some stone out of the bottom of the flag to accommodate the flag at the moment. It's been happy all winter. I could cut the rodding point down, but I don't want to, it works at the moment.

You're right, jointing could be the problem. The flag has a white marble like imperfection in it, which will identify it as the one to lift if rodding access is required. I've never needed rodding access in the 15 years I've been in the house, so in the very unlikely scenario I need access, I'll just grind out some jointing compound and lift the flag.

So the question is still, if I'm leaving a flag loose (not stuck down), should I leave the sand as at the moment, or go with a full mortar base to rest the flag on?

Posted: **Thu May 30, 2019 10:03 am**

You could be making problems for yourself by burying a RE. It's very bad practice, but not the sort of thing that would see you transported to Van Diemans' Land or swinging from a gibbet, but we like REs to be visible for avery good reasons.

In order of preference, I would suggest....

1 - find an alternative RE fitting that works for you
2 - use a small Recess Tray Cover in place of the RE and have the pipe access 'bunged' inside a shallow chamber beneath the RTC
3 - convert the RE to an Access Camber and use a RTC

Relying on a loose flag is all well and good for as long as you are around, owning the property, and in full retention of your marbles. The problem comes if you want to sell up, or if you leave this mortal coil. How can you ensure future owners, maintenance engineers, surveyiors and the like will be aware that the loose flag is actually a drain access point?

If you did put the property on the market at some point, and a keen-eyed surveyor spotted the missing RE, you could be required to reinstate it "properly", or to reduce your asking price to cover the cost of such works.

If you are intent on burying it, then you should use a disc cutter or similar to inscribe RE on the surface of the flag. This is what used to be done in the days before the modern Building Regs came into force and REs were required to be visible at the surface.

In such a case, I would coat the bed face of the candidate flag with a slury pimer based on SBR, klet it dry, then re-coat it, and let that dry. Same with the edges. Once all that slurry has properly cured (takes about 3 days) I'd then lay the candidate flag on a twenty-to-plenty mortar mix,....well, something like 12:1 OR 15:1 that will give adequate support but struggle to form a firm bond with the flag. Same for the jointing - either a weak mortar or some crap one-part polymeric (and there's no shortage of them on the market just now!)

The Brew Cabin

Laying flag over rodding points