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Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:44 pm
by Heed
I've been planning to sort out the back garden for ages. The lawn is on top of clay which never dries out properly. This makes mowing it a nightmare and also makes the lawn pretty useless for anything else as it's constantly slippery. Due to this I've decided to pave it. Or actually the missus has decided it needs paving and I'm too tight to pay someone to do it for me!

I've been on this site for the last 3 days on and off getting some brilliant ideas and advice. As the shed is on a fixed base I'm looking at having the run off split down the middle of the garden so that there is the same drop on either side of the shed for the sake of looking good.

This is the garden after pulling up the horrible looking 'council' slabs that were already down as a small patio.

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Here's the rest of the garden that needs the turf removing and 50mm of clay removing

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On Friday I have 3 tons of grit sand, 300kg of cement and almost 40 square metres of paving turning up. Along with a whacker and a cement mixer. Today I've dug half of the turf from the first photo out and tomorrows work will be the rest of the turf plus another 50mm of clay. Then it's time to get technical with string, spirit levels and pegs to set the ground levels up for the right run off.

I'm currently considering whether or not to use slab spacers from gapfast. Are they worth using for a uniform look between slabs?

I've ordered the slabs from Dove and have 40 square meters of Dove Ashbourne 'York Brown' slabs to lay on Friday afternoon. I've taught myself to tile and lay laminate flooring recently so I'm hoping it's not too difficult.

If anyone has any top tips I'd be happy to hear them. I'll post pictures during the project/build if anyone is interested.

Ross.

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:55 pm
by London Stone Paving
Hi Ross

Your not in Stoke are you by any chance? As soon as you mentioned clay soil I thought that you were probarbly in the area somewhere.

1. Did not see any MOT type 1 in your materials list. Are you not planning to use a base?

2. What size stones have you bought?

3. Not sure on the spaces, never used them.

4. I did not quite understand your meaning about the run off. Are you saying that the high point of the patio will be in the middle of the garden?

Steve

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:08 pm
by Heed
Steve,

I'm not in Stoke, I'm up in the North East just up from Newcastle.

I don't have a sub base planned as the area will only be used for light foot traffic. From what I've read I won't need a sub base.

The stones are varied between 3 sizes in packs of:

7 x 600mm x450mm
14 x 450mm x 450mm
7 x 300mm x 450mm

Yep, the high point will be the centre line down the garden.

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:13 pm
by lutonlagerlout
hmmm
sounds arse about face to me
looks to me like you have a gradual fall towards the house
paving should be on a flat plane not a rise in the middle

if you are on clay a subbase would be handy,if not you want around 75 mm of bedding on terram or similar
cheers LLL

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:21 pm
by London Stone Paving
Sorry my mistake. I come from stoke myself and the ground is proper thick red clay. All the gardens there are damp like you described.

1. Are you paving the whole back garden?

2. why dont you make the high point paralell with the house and then run it down towards the shed. It will still be on one plane and will not look out of place against the shed.

If you did it that way you could then run a level string line paralell with the house. Then set up a paralell string line (fall included) where paving is due to finish. If you them run strings down both sides paralell with the fences. You have now got a frame within which to work which is all set at exactly the right height. You can then set another stringline paralell with the house but say 3 or 4 feet down from the initial string and start paving within this section. When you have filled that section simply move the last stringline down another 3 or 4 feet and carry on paving. You cant fail cause you've fixed points to work too on all sides.

3. Whichever method you use, get your mix the right consistentency. The slabs will go down much easier. If you go to dry you will have to really smash the slabs down. If you go to wet then they will float and you will make a right mess.

4. Work out your pattern before you start mixing any cement

Steve

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:29 pm
by Heed
Cheers LLL. I'll stick another 1.5 tons of sand and the relevant cement on the order for Friday. And dig out more bloody clay!

I was against a fall towards the house due to bring water into the house. There's obviously a damp proof course there but I'd rather have water running away from the house if possible. Is this an issue or am I being paranoid about the house getting damp?

LSP, I see your method and I like it but I'm not understanding the moving things 3 to 4 feet part. Apart from that it sounds like a top plan Am I being stupid? I am paving the full garden apart from a few gaps for plants.

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:53 pm
by London Stone Paving
The point of having the moveable stringline is that you can then break down the patio into small manageable chunks. So you will be in effect paving an area as wide as your house x 3-4 feet deep at a time. You have fixed level edges close by at all points which you can easily run a spirit level to. Then when you have paved that section you move the string down another 3-4 feet and do the same again.

Does that make sense. Dont think I am explaining myself veery well TBH

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 9:35 am
by Heed
Cheers LSP. When you said move the stringline down I thought you meant in the horizontal.. As in I would have a string line 3-4 feet above the garden. That's why I was getting confused. It wasn't you explaining it badly, it was me being stupid!

Many thanks for the tips. The gear arrives tomorrow so there's a lot of digging to be done today.

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 9:59 am
by London Stone Paving
Okay, good luck with it all.

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 4:09 pm
by lutonlagerlout
string lines are always set to finished level
putting ridges or dips into patios will make it look cat
believe me i have tried it and it looks bad
LLL

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 4:46 pm
by Heed
No ridges or dips for me. The garden is now sloping towards the shed after a lot of manual labour. I've set up some of my string lines to finished level and am digging out to 100mm below them (75mm base and 25-30mm slabs).

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 5:42 pm
by lutonlagerlout
looks like you took heed mate
fair play
do it right do it once
well done
LLL

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 6:41 pm
by Heed
I see what you did there LLL!

Here's the pictures from today. I can't do any more as the earliest I could get a skip was tomorrow morning.

Almost two thirds of the turf removed

Image

Starting to make the slope fall the right way

Image

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 8:16 pm
by DNgroundworks
Fair play to you, i frankly could not be ar*ed digging all that out by hand! serious graft!

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 8:45 pm
by Heed
Cheers, I considered a mini excavator but it was £135 for a week. If I'd have known that I'd have to change the way the garden laid for the runoff I may have parted with the cash though! I reckon by the end of tomorrow it'll be ready for the mud to be compacted then on with the base on Friday morning.