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Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 2:40 pm
by superman
Hi There
I wonder if you could offer some advice please.
We plant to take up our old existing patio - there seems to be some small bed of sand and cement dryish mix - I have dug down and there seems to be a hardcore chipping base of about a few inches. It appears to be quite firm. We were planning to reuse this.
Its 16ft by 10 foot and plan to use Gladstone paving - Indian buff brown sandstone - there are the four sizes in the sett to make the irregular randaom pattern. We have to cut out for 4 small drain pipes drains.
Any advice greatly accepted please
Also, I would liek to seal the tops of teh slaps after a month or so - I really do not want any shiny look or wetlook! - I just want to seal them but am happy it it enhances their colour just a touch.
Any advice what is a good sealer please
I am planning to seal the gaps with sand/cement and grout this in - again any advice will be great.
What sort of mix should I put ontop of teh hardcore base and lay the slabs on?
Should this be wet or semi dry
Many thanks inadvance - if you have any other advice - then that would be just great - thanks all
Any tips on how to look after the sandstone please
Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 8:46 pm
by Carberry
Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 10:55 pm
by lutonlagerlout
don't touch kryptonite
LLL :;):
Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 11:36 pm
by Turbina Magnum
Indian sandstoe layed without previous paving experiance - waste of money.
Slabs are irregular size, iregular depth with iregular surface.
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:10 am
by superman
lutonlagerlout wrote:don't touch kryptonite
LLL :;):
Very funny lager lout
Watch i dont get my red eyes out and turn you to sandstone lol
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 9:40 am
by London Stone Paving
Hi
Regarding the maintenence of your sandstone.
1. Why do you want to seal the sandstone?
2. You can maintain your stone using a stiff brush and warm soapy water. You can also jet wash the stone but you should not do it too often or use too fine a jet. The reason is that the power of the water can erode the stone which opens the pores of the stone.
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 11:23 am
by superman
Thanks london
I wanted to seal it. If that is the correct thing that should be done
Do you think there is no need to do so?
Thanks
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:04 pm
by London Stone Paving
I am not trying to convince you not to seal it. Its just that a lot of incorrect information gets put around about about sealing from people who dont knoww what they are talking about.
Assuming the paving you have purchased is Indian sandstone, it probarbly does not need to be sealed unless you have a really wet north facing garden.
Sealing needs to be re-done every couple of years which further adds to the expense.
Also if you seal the stone in my opinion you dont get to experience the change in the colout when its get wet and weathered.
Advice would be just not to rush into it, it can always be done at a later date. Give it a month or two and see how the stone copes without being sealed
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:23 pm
by superman
Thanks london for your comments and advice. Makes sense and agree not to rush in
I would be happy to not seal it if the stones dont need it and could survive just being natural.as they are
Our garden is south west ish.so does get sun most of the day there
We have trees nearby and the white guttering can get that green film overtime but i wash the gutters.windows now and again
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 6:30 pm
by lutonlagerlout
superman wrote:lutonlagerlout wrote:don't touch kryptonite
LLL :;):
Very funny lager lout
Watch i dont get my red eyes out and turn you to sandstone lol
superman the answers to most of your questions are on the main site RTFM
RE:laying sandstone
we try and keep the forum to specific questions relating to individual issues
RE:sealing I seal my north facing sandstone with lithofin MN stainstop once every 2 years
this doesnt stop the green but it comes off a lot easier,also it stops red wine and blood from staining :;):
if its your first patio allow plenty of time and don't worry if you make a mistake we all do sometimes,
with pointing as a semi pro (your doing the work but not getting paid) i would suggest a polymeric either romex or GFTK
pretty much fail proof
regards LLL
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 9:40 am
by London Stone Paving
Has anyone ever heard of a sealing product called dry treat? Its approx 30% more expensive than lithofin but according to the manafacturers does not need to be re-applied. Thats when my ears pricked up because when people buy seal the first question they ask is: "How often does sealant need to be re-applied?
Sounds a bit too good to be true but when they explained the reasons for it being better, it made perfect sense. this was the basis of the pitch:
1. Lithofin stainstop for is marketed as an impregnating paving sealant. In order though for a sealant to be classified as an impregnater it only needs to penetrate a 1/3mm into the stone. Dry treat supposedly penetrates 7mm into the stone as opposed to the 1/3mm that lithofin penetrates
2. Drytreat prevents picture framing and efforesense from leaching through. Sealant can be applied 2 days after installation without any negative effects caused by trapped moisture/efforesense/salts. Adds a bit of credit to the theory on this Thread
3. Drytreat never needs to be re-applied on a domestic patio. This is due to a much higher chemical content. Lithofin is made up of 12% sealant and 88% carrier. Dry treat is 62% sealant and 38% carrier.
Obviously we have spoken to a salesman who is going to push the highlights of his own products, but it does make for interesting reading. We are going to do a few tests and see for ourselves. If all the above is true then drytreat even at 30% above the cost of lithofin, is still an absolute bargain
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 8:40 pm
by Pablo
Does it matter how much the sealant penetrates because even if it is 7mm deep the block isn't see through so it makes no difference and the surface will still wear off or fade. If you want the sealant for the way it looks then you're still going to have to re-apply regularly and TBH no one seals for any other reason.
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 9:34 pm
by lutonlagerlout
i seal purely to stop staining pablo
dont like gloss finishes
very happy with lithofin
LLL
Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:38 am
by London Stone Paving
The majority of people who buy seal from us are sealing for the reason of protecting the stone, not for the look. The impregnating sealants have a chemical in the stone which allows the stone to take in air, but not water. I am no scientist so I cannot explain the mechanics of this process but have seen demonstrations which prove it. An impreganting sealant is at its most effective 3 days after installation, after 3 days it then starts to wear off gradually until the point comes a year or 2 down the line when it needs to be re-applied. Obviously the higher the chemical content in the sealant, the longer the wearing off process takes.
From our point of view we would be much happpier if we could supply a product that did not need to be re-applied on the basis that it would be better for our customers.
Think how much wear, tear and general traffic a large commercial paving development will endure compared to a small domestic patio and then bear in mind that drytreat offer a 15 year guarantee to commercial paving projects.