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Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:16 am
by deskirk
I have a smallish job - laying a 1 metre wide pathway in the back garden . Want to lay a cross shaped (+) path in the garden , total length 12m x 1m approximately. No particularly difficult or unusual laying conditions expected. Have been quoted £1,000 for labour and laying materials i.e. everything excluding slabs. This works out at about £80 / metre sq excluding the price of slabs. Seems steep to me. Any thoughts or rule of thumb guidelines ?
ps any issues with doing this work in October /November ?
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:36 am
by Tony McC
That's excessive, and probably indicates the contractor thinks it's a ball-acher, hence the one grand price. If he gets the job, the thought of a grand for a day's work will remove most of the achiness, but with any luck, you'll find someone else to take it on.
If you reckon that it is an easy day's work for two men, and allow a rather generous 100 quid for materials, half the quoted price would be far more realistic.
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 6:18 pm
by lutonlagerlout
1 skip = £200
2 tonne type 1 =£80
1 tonne grit sand = £40
5 bags of opc = £20
slabs ???? say injun stone @ £20 per M = £240
2 blokes 1 day = £250
that makes £830 net cost , +20 % profit= £996
i dont know where the Op lives etc but round here (luton) I always allow £100 per m for quality patios,paths etc but that includes everything,so sounds like he is about £250 OTT
cheers LLL 
Edited By lutonlagerlout on 1223918404
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 10:06 am
by Tony McC
I hadn't allowed for a skip, and the OP is supplying the paving
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 12:46 pm
by GB_Groundworks
so knock the skip and the flags off -£440
= £390
i think it a priced like that because its a small job
on the main site there are a few prices i think the going rate for injun stone being £60-£65/metre for everything inc supply so it is steep
edit: wasn't your quote was it Lll?? 
:p
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 5:26 pm
by Rich H
£60-£65 all-in?
Things are bad but not that bad yet.
My range this year has been £85-£110, the low end being exactly 2 crates, no cuts at all, easy access, etc., with the high end being up and down stairs, loads of cuts/waste, recessed I/C's, linear drain into soakaway, etc.
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:46 am
by lutonlagerlout
GB_Groundworks wrote:so knock the skip and the flags off -£440
= £390
i think it a priced like that because its a small job
on the main site there are a few prices i think the going rate for injun stone being £60-£65/metre for everything inc supply so it is steep
edit: wasn't your quote was it Lll?? :p
£100 per M for injun stone if its under 20m
darn sarf waste costs are astronomical and a lot of folks dont want grab lorries destroying their gardens
i would rather be expensive and do the job right
FWIW i would have quoted around the grand mark,but that would have been proper job etc,
LLL
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 7:42 am
by Injured
Grab wagons dont have to ruin the garden. You just put visqueen down and then board out and put all spoil on that and everything underneath stays safe and clean.
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:38 am
by GB_Groundworks
i was quoting this from http://www.pavingexpert.com/york01.htm
Guide Prices
Imported Sandstone (35mm) 30m² £2,030 £68 £1,370 £46
in all honesty i would have wanted around about a grand to turn up with machine, wagon, 2 men and taken all waste away.
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:47 am
by Nigel Walker
For a company like me with 6 employees and quite high overheads, it is really difficult to price competively for small jobs.
It is impossible to stick to the same price per square metre as you would with a decent size of job.
This job - 4 Ton waste to tip £ 30
2 Ton of Type 1 collected quarry £25
Geotextile £15
Sand £ 25
Cement 5 bags £15
Indian Flags £260
Romex Terasse £60
Total Materials £430 ex vat
Labour 2 men 1 day dig off, cart away, infill with hardcore and prep
2 men 1 day lay flags and joint
It may take less than a day for dig and prep and also less than a day to lay - but depends on location, access and whether you can do another job in that day. So have to price for full days work. I have a 2 man gang who do the dig and prep work and a 2 man gang who do the laying and 1 man on tipper floating between jobs
Labour costs @ £180 per man per day = £720
So the cost for this job from me would be £1350 inc vat.
Nigel
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 5:51 pm
by Rich H
Cement around here is £4.00-£5.50. Can't think of anywhere locally where it's £3.
What about pricing in the tipper guy?
A six-yard skip holds about 7 tonnes and costs £200 here now. A 13 tonne grab is £300. Even if you do it yourself surely you price in not just disposal cost but time to load/transport/tip, fuel, vehicle amortisation, etc.
Trade prices for a 'tonne of' are £33+VAT.
Don't you add anything for materials? What if you need another small bag or an extra slab? I always put 10% on to cover my procurement overhead and risk of a small underestimation error.
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:05 pm
by James.Q
rich, grab trucks up here we only pay £160 plus vat or £200 if loads of trees and other crap. mot and sand off same driver about £18/£20 a tonne
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:10 pm
by GB_Groundworks
for the simpletons like me
Definitions of amortisation on the Web:
* Paying off the principal and interest, on a loan over a period of time (Loan Term), usually by instalments.
edit:
i'm paying £150+vat for non clay material and £180+vat clay contaminated for 8 wheeler 20 ton wagons to take it away.
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:49 pm
by Nigel Walker
Rich
Cement - If I buy a pallet of 56 i get for £2.65 each ex vat Castle OPC. Same with lots of other stuff if I buy in bulk eg Kiln Sand 56 bags = £1.85 each, Recessed Manhole Cover 450 x 600 buy 20 get for £20 each, 1m Linear Drains Galv Grating buy 96 get for £6.20 each
If i priced in for the tipper driver on this small job it would end up being really stupid money ! I would price in his costs for another job where my other gang would be working
I can dispose of waste around my way for £5.00 per ton ex vat . Skips cost me £130 ex vat for a 10yd. If I have a lot of waste I hire a 5 ton excavator £55 per day self drive + £50 delivery and 6 wheeler wagon for £28 per hour + tip costs
Dpt Type 1 hardcore - I can collect from various local quarries for between £9 - £15 per ton ex vat ex works or can get delivered for same cost per ton + £60 delivery if its a full load
For the costing in of all other costs you mentioned - this is included in the daily cost for each employee
For a 12m2 job there would be no need to add on extra for materials. If i cant measure and cost accordinaly on 12m2 i need to pack in !! I agree that you should add maybe 10% on materials for large jobs - just in case
It seems like that there is a big difference in material costs, waste, hire etc etc in different parts of the country
Nigel
Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:39 pm
by Rich H
Thanks for that. We're down to two sites for waste now between Slough & Newbury, so skip and grab costs have gone through the roof. As ever, this means more work for the pikeys. I've already seen one tipper that's been working in my area for a couple of years with 'Paving Specialists' on it repainted with 'Garden Waste Collection - 80% recycled'!
Buying in bulk is the key for materials. I don't have the space normally, and right now I don't have the confidence either!