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Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:44 pm
by Jason Herring
I've been to look at a new job this afternoon for a client who has around 80m of lovely old York Stone that she has ripped up from one side of the house and wants it relaid with grass growing in the joints. Read on..
The house is an old cottage with good grounds around the outside. The current owner has added and modified the house to some extent. The York Stone area is to be a patio and only has to take pedestrian traffic. It is to be sited where the old driveway ran from the road to the house (the driveway is now off another face of the house). The ground is highly compacted blue Cheshire clay.
When I got to the job one of my first questions was about the joints. To my surprise the client told me she wanted the joints about 3 or 4 inches wide with grass growing between the pieces of stone.
There's no problem with drainage as previous work has included planning for this.
The stone varies in size from 200mmx300mm ish up to 400x700mm. It ranges from 25mm to 110mm in thickness. The majority being 50mm plus.
So, any suggestions on how to bed the stone so that once its all done I can set to and lay turf in the gaps?! Thanks for any advice.
PS I've laid similar stone before using the individual bedding method on the main website with no problems. But that was with traditional mortar joints.
Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:51 pm
by seanandruby
I would lay as normal then gag out the joints and fill with a mixture of soil and sharp sand compact it lightly and leave it low enough for turf. i wouldn't mind betting that when you want grass to grow in the joints it wont happen, lol 
Also allow for it in your pricing it wont be a 5 minute job.
Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:25 pm
by Rich H
I would think turf would be very difficult to get right. Why not do as sean says but seed it with a mix of seed and fertilizer.
I have a garden designer friend who sowed her paving joints with soil and moss for that aged look. Mental.
Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:32 pm
by Dave_L
Everybody is different! 
Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:52 pm
by Pablo
I've had to do stuff like this a couple of times and had a few problems. I bedded the flags on semi wet mix then removed all excess mortar so they were sitting on a pillar type thing. The wider the joint the better chance of success 3 inches is quite tight. Because the soil is surrounded by mortar it is very prone to waterlogging even with good drainage. I have tried a variety of soil mixes and the lighter the better but it needs constant feeding to keep it lush. Any areas in shade are gonna give trouble the combo of waterlogging and shade kills the grass everytime. The other problem is that no matter how well you compact the soil it will always settle further leaving the flags slightly proud so it needs lots of topdressing. I've had more success and better results with seed rather than turf. Good luck and stay on the safe side with the pricing if you don't get it then probably doing you a favour anyway.
Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 11:40 am
by Tony McC
There's a drawing, somewhere, showing exactly this construction. However, my desktop pc has died, which is part of the reason behind my poor attendance over recent weeks, so I can't get at it until that Dell bloke comes around on Monday to rebuild the entire bloody network.
If I can't get to it then, I'll run up a new version later this week.
Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 10:56 am
by Spitfire
Rich H wrote:I would think turf would be very difficult to get right. Why not do as sean says but seed it with a mix of seed and fertilizer.
I have a garden designer friend who sowed her paving joints with soil and moss for that aged look. Mental.
i agree m8, with turf being bout 2 pound a roll trade price your better off seeding, more likely to take effectively rather than the lime from the mix killing off edges. ???
Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:04 pm
by Jason Herring
Thanks for the replies so far! I think I'm going to lay on a full wet bed over compacted MOT and leave the joints as empty as possible. Then, when the whole thing has set I'll go back and cut/grind out mortar between the flags and remove the MOT underneath.
I can get my hands on some nice light loamy soil and mix in some grit sand to fill in with. Then turf. I'll stay in touch with progress and would still appreciate any advice as, if I get the job, won't be starting it for 5 or 6 weeks at the earliest.
PS Spitfire.. I buy really nice turf for 60p/m
Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:36 pm
by Rich H
I thought I was getting a good price at £1.75!! That's the Thames Valley for you...
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:40 am
by seanandruby
I think you are better gagging out the joints as you go. you will be surprised how long it will take you to cut and chip, plus the dust, or grout stains.
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 8:18 pm
by Pablo
Is that for a linear metre or m/2 if it's linear then thats on the money +vat but otherwise thats an incredible price.
Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 9:36 pm
by Jason Herring
60p per square metre. and it's top quality.
Posted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 7:47 am
by Spitfire
Im in South London, nuffins cheap! have tried other turf, but Royce Turf has been spot on for me, takes beautifully and real rich green. costs me bout 1.75 a square meter and worth every penny!
Posted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 9:44 am
by Tony McC
That Royce turf: does it come in Rolls? :p
Posted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:10 pm
by Pablo
Very good Mr McC
[quote]60p per square metre. and it's top quality
You must be getting that Knocked off mate hows the local golf course looking patchy brown I bet.