Posted: Mon May 02, 2011 6:21 pm
DDD made you think tho
to be honest, as i put the strap on i wondered "is this safe" :p
to be honest, as i put the strap on i wondered "is this safe" :p
The Brew Cabin
Paving, Drainage and Hard-landscaping in Britain and Ireland
https://ext.pavingexpert.com/brewcabin/
The easy way to lay slabs - Slab lifter
https://ext.pavingexpert.com/brewcabin/viewtopic.php?t=13902
Page 4 of 5
to be honest, as i put the strap on i wondered "is this safe" :p
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 3:24 pm
Ye it was sean, 8 bedroom, 3 storey property, on 8 acres of land............:rock:, ill carry each one of 300 square metres over next time eh....
:rock:
:rock:
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 4:44 pm
Well ,I was speaking from experience ,not just to be a wet blanket (see 'boreman' comment) :;):msh paving wrote:The chances of the stap getting cut compleatly through and the slab falling are somewhere between slim and zero, there is more chance the sucky lifter will run out off battery power and let go first.
When the strop gets cut,this reduces its lifting capacity, so if your money bags and can afford lots of strops, ok, but if your not and using the same one over and over, in this way,you will get fined (on a big site) or a nickname like 'Lefty' ?
I know the difference between cost and practicality,this advice is meant in a 'big' site way, but just trying to imbue the forum with a bit of wisdom ,as unless youve had as much time looking through a machine window as me, you'd not know till its too late
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 5:17 pm
DNG,
Read this carefully mate. If you happen to have an accident in that Manito and cause serious injury too anyone, you will be arrested and held overnight to allow the HSE to speak to all witnesses unimpeded.
The next day once released you will be interviewed by the HSE who will ask for all Certificates of training, Insurance,MS,RA statement etc etc etc and remember with the HSE you have to PROVE YOUR INNOCENCE, they do not have to prove your guilt.
They will have already checked out all of the above while your locked up mate.
My advice pay for the Ticket.
Read this carefully mate. If you happen to have an accident in that Manito and cause serious injury too anyone, you will be arrested and held overnight to allow the HSE to speak to all witnesses unimpeded.
The next day once released you will be interviewed by the HSE who will ask for all Certificates of training, Insurance,MS,RA statement etc etc etc and remember with the HSE you have to PROVE YOUR INNOCENCE, they do not have to prove your guilt.
They will have already checked out all of the above while your locked up mate.
My advice pay for the Ticket.
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 6:06 pm
Read this carefully mate. If you happen to have an accident in that Manito and cause serious injury too anyone, you will be arrested and held overnight to allow the HSE to speak to all witnesses unimpeded
Does this apply to the farmer where my yard is(he no longer farms the land but rents it out). He has a manitou and is always using it here and there. i use it too to load stuff. Its not the work site so does it apply?
The machine has no reverse beep, and he has already run over and killed his dog, although health and safety would not be interested in that!
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 6:40 pm
On private ground as long as you do not kill anyone its happy days and you can do what you like.
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 8:44 pm
On the above, the HSE can prosocute you for unsafe acts on your own land etc but even they know when to give up.
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 9:30 pm
It has amazed me how a simple picture of an innocent little job, using a back saving tool, has escalated into a health and safety nightmare!
What will my next picture bring ? ???
What will my next picture bring ? ???
Posted: Tue May 03, 2011 11:24 pm
you didnt quote for a turfing job in abbotogad Pakistan did you dan?
LLL
LLL
Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 3:17 pm
Rab, how on earth would i run someone over when there is nobody else near the machine? i can understand on a busy busy job like yours though the need for tickets etc.
If i was to get up to date with every ticket and every bit of training and policy i reckon it would cost somewhere in the region of £20000, a sum i just cant afford, so until i can, common sense and the experience i have will have to suffice.
If i was to get up to date with every ticket and every bit of training and policy i reckon it would cost somewhere in the region of £20000, a sum i just cant afford, so until i can, common sense and the experience i have will have to suffice.
Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 3:18 pm
DNgroundworks wrote:But i mostly agree with DDD, if we (as small private contractors) were to implement every little piece of h&s law and practice we would be out of business in no time. Yes look after the customers and the public, but if i want to jump on a manitou and move a pack of flags 50 yrds across site whilst my brother is putting a mix on wearing no hi-viz, i dont have a manitou ticket or any formal training but is that really that unsafe?
Its not unsafe until someone gets accidentally crushed to death. I know its unlikely and unexpected but thats the nature of an accident. As soon as you start using plant and heavy machinery then the game changes and you've got to take measures to protect your staff and cover your own arse at the same time
We've had to sharpen up on our health & safety this year Dan as well. I would say that at least 50% of the measures we have taken have been token measures to simply "tick a box". Its all about covering your back and demonstrating that you have thought about the risks associated with the job and put measures in place to reduce those risks as much as is practically possible. As frustrating as the process has been it has given me peace of mind and encouraged my lads to raise their game
Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 3:18 pm
Regarding rabs point about you must have a ticket not according to hse website
There is NO legal requirement to follow any particular card scheme. The UK Contractors Group, (UKCG), successors to the Major Contractors Group, (MCG), have stated their preference for the CPCS scheme for their site operations. Does this create unfairness or a cartel? In a court of law, it probably would be seen in that context.
Dan same here I've got 10m public liability insurance and 15 years under by belt running everything from micros to once ran a 85 ton cat
I need to spend 10k on training loose a few jobs as I'd be training and then not be physically able to keep enough hours logged in the log books to keep them anyways. Today I have run 3 ton, 3cx, 13 ton, telehandler, tracked and wheeled dumpers and a tractor. Oh and loader dozer onto lowloader as we've sold it.
Edited By GB_Groundworks on 1304519329
There is NO legal requirement to follow any particular card scheme. The UK Contractors Group, (UKCG), successors to the Major Contractors Group, (MCG), have stated their preference for the CPCS scheme for their site operations. Does this create unfairness or a cartel? In a court of law, it probably would be seen in that context.
Dan same here I've got 10m public liability insurance and 15 years under by belt running everything from micros to once ran a 85 ton cat
I need to spend 10k on training loose a few jobs as I'd be training and then not be physically able to keep enough hours logged in the log books to keep them anyways. Today I have run 3 ton, 3cx, 13 ton, telehandler, tracked and wheeled dumpers and a tractor. Oh and loader dozer onto lowloader as we've sold it.Edited By GB_Groundworks on 1304519329
Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 4:56 pm
If you have the tickets you can prove in a court that you have been completely trained on the plant you are using.
If you hire a mini digger for the weekend and accidentally kill but not bury the wife you would get off with it as it would be classed as an accident.
On a building site its completely different as you are the employer with a legal duty of care.
In a court of law in the uk sgb scaffolding had to pay out one of the largest fines ever issued for a h&s breach.
The court agreed that their h&s procedures were amongst the highest etc but due to one of there men's actions a young woman lost her life jogging past a site. the man in question was crippled.
If you hire a mini digger for the weekend and accidentally kill but not bury the wife you would get off with it as it would be classed as an accident.
On a building site its completely different as you are the employer with a legal duty of care.
In a court of law in the uk sgb scaffolding had to pay out one of the largest fines ever issued for a h&s breach.
The court agreed that their h&s procedures were amongst the highest etc but due to one of there men's actions a young woman lost her life jogging past a site. the man in question was crippled.
Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 5:32 pm
Is that the one on the infamous safety video, where hes organizing his motor for an MOT and offloads a plank from the 3rd floor at the same time? God ,must he seen that one more times than The Wizard of Oz!rab1 wrote:The court agreed that their h&s procedures were amongst the highest etc but due to one of there men's actions a young woman lost her life jogging past a site. the man in question was crippled.
Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 5:35 pm
here's an interesting one. Am am sure many of you have heard of hinowa? they make skip loading dumpers. they were they only ones around years ago, and hss were the only ones who hired them at an extortionate £500 for the week. they weren't that good either, the skip never properly discharged. Anyway, i digress.
They have a small platform that you can stand on when travelling.
When i brought my tcp tracked dumper, i asked why they did not have one. The answer was that health and safety did not allow it on uk built machines, but imported machines were ok ?? go figure ???
They have a small platform that you can stand on when travelling.
When i brought my tcp tracked dumper, i asked why they did not have one. The answer was that health and safety did not allow it on uk built machines, but imported machines were ok ?? go figure ???