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Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:40 am
by davelad
I'm not sure what kind of sand they used to be honest. There are bags of cement in the front garden and a pile of sand in the back garden. What difference does the sand make to the job if you don't mind me asking?
This is the sand.
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:10 am
by Injured
"When working with an unbound bed, DO NOT USE BUILDING SAND - it is too soft and can become 'fluid' when waterlogged, consequently moving beneath the flags, causing settlement."
Direct quote from Tonys page on bedding flags.
Check here
http://www.pavingexpert.com/layflag1.htm
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:14 pm
by ambient
not gypo"s are they the job looks terrible doesnt look like they have any idea what they are doing ,i would tell them to forget it and get somebody who knows what they are doing maybe someone off here can sort it,dont pay them anything if theyve got a problem let them take up flags theyre no good now anyway all full of mix 
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:23 pm
by DNgroundworks
So hows it gone today?
Looks like building sand to me!
Were abouts in the uk are you davelad?
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:57 pm
by meany
On bigger jobs, say £5000 plus,i always ask for 30% upfront.It shows the ability to pay and not fob u off with excuses at the end with non payment.Bigger jobs than that go into stage payments.
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 8:48 pm
by topgrafter2007
get them and there equipment off your property asap! they havent got a clue and never will have mate. chancers, gypo's, whatever they are they aint tradesmen! GET RID...
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 8:54 pm
by msh paving
I've chucked better mixers away than that sorry excuse for a mixer,looks more like a square box than a mixer bowl MSH 
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:23 pm
by davelad
OK, told the boss,pretty much what you lot had said, needless to say he wasn't too happy, but he conceded that it was a balls up and he put it down to the torrential rain yesterday - we know different, but I think he was trying to save face.
Anyway, they aren't gyppos, the boss live about 2 miles from me, I'm in Walkden, Greater Manchester and he's from Astley.
They've been and got a spirit level, which I insisted on 
They have fixed the sagging and uneven flags and the part next to the grass has been extended by one half flag and they've levelled it out. They have about 90% of the indian stone down now, but they ran out as they'd added the extra bit.
Rain stopped play again - some of it is pointed now, but there's a big tarpaulin over that bit and it's still bucketing it down, so no photos at the moment, sorry
I think they should have it done tomorrow morning if the weather is ok, so I'll get some photos done when they bog off for their dinner.
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:32 pm
by msh paving
how can they point it in the rain,what about the mortar staining,what about the straight joints,
keep his money back to absolutly perfect no half measures MSH
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:57 pm
by davelad
It wasn't raining when he pointed it, but it was raining as he was laying the stones.
Oh yes, no more money til it's right. I've just noticed that the new line of flags next to the grass stops about 3-4ft from the fence - that looks awful, so I'll get him to sort that tomorrow. He was saying something earlier about going underneath the bush, and that must have been what he was on about.
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:06 pm
by ambient
should have tried me i cover your area if you dont get it sorted pm me and ill come and have a look
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:11 pm
by jay-Manor Driveways
wow its just amazing how some firms get away with what they do , im glad you have come on here for advice because can you imagine what it would be like if you hadnt said any thing ,
good luck and dont pay any more untill you ar 100% happy .
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:13 pm
by Rich H
What a shame. Hope it works out, Dave.
On the subject of deposits; I always take one unless a) the job is done and dusted in a couple of days or b) I know the client very well.
It's not about whether I can afford to fund it or not, it's just not good practice to expose my business to risk. Apart from the wages, which are an overhead, I think that projects should be funded on a cost-neutral basis. The customer provides a deposit equivalent to the outlay required by the contractor. Both parties are then on an equitable footing. I've done week-long jobs before and then the customer's gone off on holiday for a month without paying me. Sod that. It's deposit and stage payments these days and settlement of the balance on the day of completion. That's perfectly reasonable and sound business sense. Nothing to do with levels of professionalism.
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:18 am
by jay-Manor Driveways
what do the customers think of that arrangment rich because so much is punted around to clients saying full payment on completion , think this settles there mind your not going to do a runner with there cash ( thanks rouge traders lol)
whats there reaction when you ask for a lump up front
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:37 am
by Injured
I ask for 25% on starting day for all my work.
You do get one or two people who are wary but generally they are using you because they trust you. To a degree!
What clients tend to forget is that we can get stung just as much as them.
fortunately I havent been.
Fingers crossed never will be.
So trust goes both ways and I think that with a payment to start with gains trust for both parties.
