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Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:48 pm
by lutonlagerlout
we are still pricing, but not getting the response of say, a year ago. the auld fella said " shall we cut the profit" i think its a bad idea,if you start running a business for wages alone,you'll soon be in trouble,getting a lot of letters and phone calls from people looking for work,which is heartbreaking,i've been there myself
LLL
Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:35 pm
by williams
Really bad here tbh, not winning many jobs. Too dear all the time and not by a little either. If i quote a job for 5k then there seems to be several others quoting for 3k, if i was to do the job for that money then i,d be earning a couple of hundred pounds and thats if everything goes to plan. And we all know it never does, the amount of jobs ido where the ground is soft crap so has to come out causing more grab costs and more type 1 cost.....
Plenty round here charging £40-£50 per m for alphas! crazy really.
But they still make money, shallow dig, crushed concrete, bash the job out and they still earn what i would out of the 5k job. Maybe more as they probably dont pay any tax either.
Never mind, maybe its a run of bad luck which does happen, i could quote 10 jobs and get none then the next ten get them all.
Just quoted 3 nice jobs this week, all sound promising but i just don't know what to expect now tbh.
I have dropped my labour rate by a fair amount but with materials going up it hasnt made much difference. The other guys have slashed their labour rates and slashed the materials too so how can you compete with that!
Quite demorolising really, i wont drop my standards though which i think for the long run is the best. I just sold a nice car i had and have savings so worst ways i,ll sit at home for 3 years.
Edited By williams on 1239568672
Posted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:06 pm
by lutonlagerlout
agree with williams 100%
LLL
Posted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 3:48 pm
by worldofpaving
Yup, me too.
You have a very nice and professional website that builds confidence, so in your place I would firstly review all of my sales and marketing materials and approach - do they convey well enough the time we have been in the business, the number of satisfied customers we have in the area? : do I have enough current testimonial letters from clients, enough current photo's of recent jobs, have I got boards or a-frames in place at particularly good looking jobs, have I leafleted the roads surrounding these nice jobs?
I would then look at what warranties I can offer, discounts for 2 or more neighbours ordering at the same time, etc., in other words, what can I do to get a demonstrable edge over the cowboys and undercutters without getting into a Dutch auction with them.
Try never to give away anything in a promotion that they will have to buy anyway, add something that they would not otherwise have bought - e.g. some resin-bound jointing sand, sealing the drive, half price 8 sq m patio, etc.- might be a statement of the bleedin' obvious as Basil Fawlty would put it, but a £200 value to them might be a £60 cost to you but £100 off the quote is 100 quid to both you......
Make sure your price is the last one they get and always attemp to deliver your quote in person, preferably when husband and wife are at home.
If some of these things sound a bit cheesy, these really are some of the things that the big boys who sell paving at hugely inflated prices swear by, added to the perception of quality that surrounds their well-known name.
Best,
WOP
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 6:40 pm
by williams
I thought i,d add another post here.
I,m getting sick of it now. I,ve slashed my prices big time and guess what....its still too dear!
Quoted loads of jobs but its the same thing time and time again. I actually have very little work now, which is amazing as last year i was getting maybe 7 out of 10 jobs through recomendation but recomendation this year seems to mean nothing at all.
I,m working for crap wages so when things go wrong its ridiculous, i dont actually know how much more i can take tbh.
In my eyes i,m doing everthing in terms of quoting well, they all seem to like me and what im saying but that doesnt matter when im a couple of hundred dearer.
I,ll give an example, quoted a crappy job the other day £1561 inc vat, the materials were costing me about £900.
I lost that job because he got some one round for £1050 inc vat apparantly!
yea right like anyone is going to do 3 days work for £100 :p
I actually dont know what to do, i can turn my hand but of couse theres no site work or work for any companys out there and the work that is there is dribs and drabs for ridiculous money and its real crap work that no one else wants.
Listen to this one.....
A neighbour recomended me to their friend, gave them my web address etc, never got a call....
They get another local guy to do it, he charges 55 inc vat for brett alphas !
so he goes round there and gives them a price, then when he starts he shows them an omega and an alpha, naturally they choose the alpha thinking they are the same price....
comes to end of job and the job he quoted for was actually omegas for 30 per m and as they had alpha its now 90 per sq m!!!!! making the job 5k which in my eyes is the right price but still...
Hes got bundles of work, but then tricking people into thinking 30 per m and then stinging them is what i would call a scam almost.
I feel better for getting that off my chest anyway :O
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:16 pm
by lutonlagerlout
its like a death rattle round luton,anyone that says they are stacked out round here is lying
my mate ( a builder)got nicked for a driving offence the other day and the 2 coppers said although their wages were safe they were still apprehensive about making any big ticket spends.
I have an allotment this year and if it does come to a juddering halt i will spend more time over there ,trying to grow stuff that the wireworm,pigeons,aphids have not eaten
a guy the other day said to me would i build him a garden wall for a 100 quid?
out of curiousity i asked home many bricks?
to which he replied "2 packs" LOL
he wanted me to lay approx 900 bricks for a ton 
with running costs its not worth me doing any job for less than £150,the figures just dont add up
LLL
Edited By lutonlagerlout on 1240251435
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:03 pm
by msh paving
He's lucky people will pay the extra,
I'm working for a farmer at the moment he buys his materials through Anglia Farmer's one off the largest buying groups in uk he is getting cemex 50mm chelsea setts for £11.78m2 i cant buy them at that price no how no way,why are farmers getting paving material cheaper than the paving industry this was a direct load price for 17 packs
Lucky he paying daywork so im cutting the rev's down a bit MSH 
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:23 pm
by lutonlagerlout
if you get an ex-works load of anything it always comes cheaper MSH ,if we buy 8000 bricks at a time we normally get 20 % discount,problem is only the largest extensions/walls have this amount of bricks 
LLL
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:38 pm
by GB_Groundworks
i'm doing a quote at the moment for a horse arena, been helping the lady get planning permission, sorted her an engineer & architect etc for over a year but she has just said unless i'm significantly cheaper than a national company who do 150-200 arenas a year i wont get it.
just going to price it as usual can't make a loss on the work.
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 10:53 pm
by Dave_L
williams wrote:I,m getting sick of it now. I,ve slashed my prices big time and guess what....its still too dear!
I,ll give an example, quoted a crappy job the other day £1561 inc vat, the materials were costing me about £900.
I lost that job because he got some one round for £1050 inc vat apparantly!
Yep, have to agree; we're very in a very similar position - rates are on the floor - to a point we are almost buying work.
It takes a lot of work to keep tarmac crews occupied - and the work out there isn't enough to keep everyone busy.
We're small-fry ~ the bigger outfits must be shedding staff left right and bloody centre.
Drivers are having their rates cut by the quarries, it's all looking rather bleak out there. Lime Kilns are being shut down, some quarries completely mothballed.
Posted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 8:34 pm
by henpecked
williams wrote:I,ll give an example, quoted a crappy job the other day £1561 inc vat, the materials were costing me about £900.
I lost that job because he got some one round for £1050 inc vat apparantly!
yea right like anyone is going to do 3 days work for £100 :p
Must have been robbing the gear ??? ]
Its a joke for me too, Im a machine driver, in the past 4 yaers I could have cloned myself I was getting that much business in the summer. This year Im doing the patio . Had work come in but the rates and duration really are a joke. Stay at home till things pick up, got a few quid int he bank so now worries till next year 
HP
