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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:00 pm
by Tony McC
williams wrote:The nature of those blocks means if they were cut they would look hideous. If they were jointed inbetween that imo would also look pretty poor.
They can be double-taper cut (ie: cut on each long edge) using a saw to create a neat looking joint. This will cause the loss of the gently rounded corners, and possibly result in a block that looks different to the main paving, but it would look far better than what is there at the moment.
Joints >6mm are not in compliance with 7533:3 2005, and mortared joints just look chuffing awful. This leaves two options: cutting as described above, or using an alternative paving to form the tread.
Those step risers are also amateurish. They, too, should have been taper cut (either single or double) and then mortar jointed. It is possible to create a relative fast arc using uncut units, if a proper mortar joint is used. I have a 900mm radius semi-circular step outside my own front door constructed using 'standard' kerb units (rather than the over-priced taper units that can be bought) and it looks fine. However, the practice of having the kerb units/step risers in direct contact with neighbouring units on the 'inside' of the arc, and then filling the gaping joint with mortar is shoddy. The WHOLE joint should be mortared, with not less than 9mm at the inside edge and not more than 20mm at the face. When the joint is greater than 20mm, cut the bloody units to a taper - it looks SO much better.
Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:25 pm
by msh paving
the price anglian charged the should have used double taper kerbs,it a easy way out what the did,poor attention to finish and fit
Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:22 am
by lutonlagerlout
i stand by what i say ,it doesn't look a bad job from here
TBH tony wouldn't fancy building a step for you :;): cutting 10mm -0 off every kerb
lot of dust there for little return
they could have used coloured mortar i suppose,but i feel these lads are getting crucified for what is an essentially fine job
LLL 
Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:43 am
by seanandruby
r u looking at the same photo? it looks shite. definitely get the stillettoes stuck in those joints 
Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 7:32 am
by ambient
and it all lines up thought tegula type paving is not supposed to line up for three rows in random bond if youre paying that sort of money i would expect perfection ???
Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:22 am
by carlbeardsmore
If you taper the blocks with a stihl saw then throw them in a clean mixer with a bit of water for a few mins, they look tumbled again.
I know with all the cutting and tumbling, it takes time but the effect is worth it if you are paying that sort of money.
Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:53 am
by Tony McC
With steps at a front door, it's the one thing visitors and residents spend most time looking at, so getting them right is, IMO, critical. Bodged mortar joints, avoiding 30 mins of extra work in cutting (and if you abide by the new HSE guidelines, there's no dust to speak of!), usually indicates a slack attitude to the work as a whole.
If that monstrosity was outside my front door, I'd be refusing to pay until it was demolished and a proper step was built in its place.
Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:24 am
by lutonlagerlout
KK point taken,if anything the different riser heights are what is wrong with the steps.
when i stayed at the reebok stadium i noticed many hundreds of these tapered cuts around the base of columns there,looked very neat
for steps i generally use a combination of tapered kerbs and straight ones to achieve the curve(?) and always bed steps onto a cementious mix.
would anyone have any photos of these many tapered cut steps that everyone is on about??
LLL
Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:38 pm
by williams
I wouldn't go as far as calling it a monstrosity.
I think tapered cuts would look as bad although i must admit that throwing them in a mixer with water would re tumble them-good idea that man!
They look like classico to me as well with rounded edges which would make it even harder to taper them properly unless you cut both sides.
I,ve seen far far worse daily by almost every other paving firm about.
Although 6k is top top money.
Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:28 pm
by lutonlagerlout
maybe its my environment of very low quality pavements that i see every day,that is shrouding my judgement
round these parts its very common to see just block paves built like bricks into steps,
IC insert covers sticking 25 mm out of drives that have sunk
edge courses haunched with mortar ,that have moved 20 mm laterally
about 90% of what i see around luton is like this
heartbreaking
LLL
Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:32 pm
by seanandruby
the name of this site is "paving expert." the boss has done a very professional job setting it up and inviting "experts" to give their opinions and advice. this means we have specialist skills and knowledge. therefore we should do quality work and expect others in our game to do likewise. those steps are a mess, not in complience and not 100%. different height risers, joints to big, sand joints in contrasting colours and multi coloured morter joints.
if you had to spend a few hours cutting and shaping to make a job astheticaly pleasing to the eye, then so be it. nuff said.
Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:22 am
by williams
Ok the rest of it is a bit dodgy. I was just looking at the cuts and just scanned the pic, looking back yes the heights are different, the muck is different colours and also it looks like the step is not central to the door.
However if you want to see some step monstrositys come round this way. Theres one local company whoes trademark seems to be
omega 50mm in 90 degree in brindle
charcol soldier border
step built from random bricks mucked straight onto the paving with alphas mucked to the bricks- now thats a monstrosity!
Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:31 am
by seanandruby
now if you were to take photos of "dodgy" steps, work etc and some photos of your own work, put them in your "bad jobs" portfolio to show clients the difference in workmanship that is a good selling point. :;):
Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:34 am
by GB_Groundworks
sean rights the name of the site isn't "that'll do as its friday and i want to be done and paid and get to the pub" mediocrity shouldn't be encourage because other less professional people are doing dub standard work. mrs workingmum's question was are the steps ok and they aren't, would you be happy with them on your house or worse your mums house? i certainly wouldn't and would want them correcting.
just my 2p
gi
Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:44 am
by GB_Groundworks
maybe she could point them in this direction
main page steps for block paving