Page 2 of 3
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:52 am
by Tony McC
London Stone Paving wrote:Would it not be possible for you to post these opinions on there behalfs Tony?
For whatever reason, the prevailing attitude seems to be that they're happy to talk to me 'off the record' but won't 'go public'.
I had a long telephone conversation yesterday with the MD of an ETI member and he'd called to sort-of thank me for publishing exactly what he felt about the situation, and what he's brought up at some ETI meetings, but didn't feel would be commercially sensible to publish using his company's name.
Someone else, not an ETI member, made a similar point. If they were to say they supported the aims of ETI but had reservations regarding the effectiveness, it could be misconstrued and misrepresented to be a disavowal of the work ETI is doing on the ground.
I don't full agree with that perception, but then, I'm not risking the commercial reputation of my business. I'm just an opinionated big mouth wioth nowt to lose!
Having said all that, I repeat what I said previously: if anyone wants to post using a pseudonym or wants me to post anonymously on their behalf, I'm happy to help however I can.
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:02 pm
by mickg
I understand that George and its certainly non of our business to tell them how to spend their money, I posted the link as it was in the last few days they launched the rocket
surely for all things to be equal the Indian government should be leading it with other countries giving support not the other way round, I was not given an answer while I was at the meeting as it ended before I was given an opportunity to ask, I have asked "twice" for a copy of the powerpoint presentation but not received a reply
my honest opinion at this moment in time is I travelled 240 miles to return none the wiser as to why we are leading this and no one to date has given me the reason, the small percentage we import into the UK from the 4% of their export still equates to a lot of million square metres of paving per year so the answer may be in the corporate side of importing product for financial gain of which I know nothing about - I just lay the stuff
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:33 pm
by PavingSuperstore
It's OK Mick - I'm really not that political. I just don't think the ETI will make that much difference to the industry as a whole, but if as an individual, I have a clear conscience, then that's the best I can hope for. There's so many things across the world that are unjust, unethical, unsavoury etc, we cannot change them all. We just have to be ambassadors for the things we can change and influence. It was only 150 years or so ago, that our country would have had children working in quarries too. Must admit, I'm starting to think the one-way trip to Mars is quite a good idea.
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:43 pm
by mickg
>>>>>I'm starting to think the one-way trip to Mars is quite a good idea.
brilliant idea I'll find the sign up link 
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:06 pm
by PavingSuperstore
They'll need paving contractors up there...get in quick!
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:15 pm
by rab1
How many people really care about the conditions of the workers that quarried the stone for the new patio. Cost is the no1 priority in most cases and always will be.
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:28 pm
by mickg
OK I will throw this one into the pot
imagine if it was your grandchild who was working in the quarry, how would you react ?
same ?
different ?
its not on my doorstep so it does not matter ?
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:22 pm
by rab1
I agree with what your saying Mick but as the end client, who asks/cares...?.
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:37 pm
by London Stone Paving
George, you would be surprised to know (and I was surprised too) that India does actually have a benefits system. It's actually causing quite a few problems over there because the benefits being paid are quite high and there is not a huge incentive for people on lower wages to work (sounds familiar :p ).
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:40 pm
by lutonlagerlout
mick if you were worried about exploitation you wouldnt use a mobile phone
a mate of mine,an ex squaddie does security escorts for coltan in the DRC
he gets £400 a day
the miners in appalling conditions get $10 a day
colatan
its all down to globalization
LLL
Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:46 pm
by mickg
I'm not worried about it I was just throwing it out to the brew cabin regulars to further the debate
a mobile phone is now a way of life and an interruption of the working day, why is it exploitation ?
Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 9:20 am
by PavingSuperstore
London Stone Paving wrote:George, you would be surprised to know (and I was surprised too) that India does actually have a benefits system. It's actually causing quite a few problems over there because the benefits being paid are quite high and there is not a huge incentive for people on lower wages to work (sounds familiar :p ).
Hope they're not following the UK as a role model. It will be interesting to see what happens to the price of natural stone, if the people do start complaining about lower wages. Obviously the ETI works towards a minimum working wage already, but will the shysters who exploit the system find themselves short of workers in the future? Will there be a day when Indian stone increases to the price of British Yorkstone for instance? Or will there be an influx of immigrant workers happy to work at the lower wage?
Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 10:07 am
by lutonlagerlout
Just an example mick, mobiles need coltan so effectively anyone using one has blood on their hands , same as with diamonds gold etc
I won't lose sleep over it as we can only play the hand we are dealt in life
Cheers LLL
Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 5:26 pm
by mickg
yeah gotya, I did not click on the link ???
Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 10:03 pm
by Carberry
mickg wrote:India has just sent a spaceship to Mars
At a cost of 45 million
The Asian country, which has widespread poverty, has spent more than £600million in total on its space programme.
We are still giving 280 million a year aid, last year India's then finance minister Pranab Mukherjee said UK aid was “a peanut in our total development expenditure�.
so while the people are starving and living in poverty the Indian government thinks its a good idea to launch a spaceship to a far away planet......where are the ethics here ?
No doubt that's a cover for intercontinental ballistics. Last book I read had their nuclear Missile range at 3000 miles I think... basically close enough to nuke Pakistan and continue their argument over Kashmir.
I've never looked into the ethical stone stamp, I'm curious as to what they actually do and would like to see some figures. I do know that when I was in economics lectures ~10 years ago I was the only one in the class that said I would still buy from a company that uses sweatshops, I know they are crap working conditions but that is all these people have to live off of.