Best way to move a mini digger about

[mickg]

Should your 3.5 ton van be fitted with a tacho

The law states that the weight of the trailer must be added to the gross vehicle weight of the van.

So if the van has a gvw of 3.5 tonnes and it’s towing a two-tonne trailer, the vehicle effectively weighs 5.5 tonnes and must have a tachograph – and you’ll need an O-licence to operate it too.

There are exceptions to this rule and the main two that may apply are:

If the vehicle is not being used for hire and reward
If the vehicle doesn’t travel more than 50km (33 miles) from its base.

What is not Hire or Reward
You are NOT usually operating for Hire or Reward when you carry goods you own or goods you have used or will use in the course of your business.

Changes to operator licensing rules for vehicles under 3.5 tonnes towing small trailers

because most of us here travel from A to B in the course of our day then its classed as "NOT" for hire or reward therefore we do not need an operators licence or need to use a tacho

[williams]

That's right, it took me a while to determine what these laws mean but ultimately if your using the machine yourself in your own buisness then you don't need the o licence, looking at the above it appears you don't need a tacho either.

I could well fit one of these to the dash in any case :p
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taco

What do you think mickg about what I mentioned above about the owing in the new shape sprinter? I'm guessing yours pulls the trailer and machine ok? The main thing I'm worried about is safety, don't get me wrong I don't want any fines but I do want it to be safe, sadly the red tape small buisness is up against isn't necessarily sensible or about safety, it's more about, well nothing it appears.

[tarmal & Co]

If you check on the government site about operaters licenses it will explain that you do need operaters license for van and trailer. I have a restricted operaters license and I only do my own work but still have to have one.
You can register to be exempt from tachos if you don't go any further than 50km from your base.It gets very complicated to try and stay legal

[dig dug dan]

i think mickg posted the relevant link

[GB_Groundworks]

There was a piece in earthmovers a while back that covered most of this, on Sunday ill dig it out and see if I can scan it in.

Sure they said 60 mile radius of base moving a digger which you then use is tachometer exempt as your not a professional truck driver you are a digger driver who just moved the machine to the job. Might have been specific to utilities though.

[mickg]

I read this yesterday what mentions the radius of 62 miles

BALI works with ELCA to achieve compromise on tachograph regulations

The amendment negotiated by ELCA at the EU Commission means that vehicles with a total weight of up to 7.5 tonnes, working exclusively within a radius of 100 km (62 miles) from their company base and that transport material, equipment and machines required by the driver of the vehicle to carry out his work, are exempted from the requirement to install a digital tachograph. The vehicle driver must not be a full-time driver

[dig dug dan]

Reading that mick, it suggests I could buy a 6.3 tonner and not require a tacho?

[Dave_L]

It's a very very grey area this - the NOT for hire or reward is a grey area - surely the machine is being transported by the 'company' doing the works, and this transport has to be factored into the job, you're not doing it for free....

[mickg]

As per the VOSA link

Issued: 23 December 2011 Changes to operator licensing rules for vehicles under 3.5 tonnes towing small trailers

What is not Hire or Reward
You are NOT usually operating for Hire or Reward when you carry goods you own or goods you have used or will use in the course of your business.

Examples
In each of the following examples a Van below 3,500 kgs (3.5t) and a small trailer is used to transport a mini-digger from a depot to a work site. The gross plated weights of vehicle and trailer when combined exceed 3.5t.

These examples cover most circumstances; however there are more than these simple examples so if you are in any doubt please contact VOSA Enquiries.

Example 1 - The digger is owned by you, the user of the vehicle. You use the digger on the site. This transport is done on your own account and you do not need an operator’s licence.

Example 2 - The digger is rented by you, the user of the vehicle. You use the digger on the site. This transport is done on your own account and you do not need an operator’s licence.

Example 3 - The digger is rented by you, the owner of the digger is the user of the vehicle (they deliver to site for you to use). You use the digger on the site. This transport is done on the "own account" of the digger renting company and they do not need an operator’s licence.

Example 4 - The digger is owned by the building company, you collect it from building company’s depot and bring to site. You use the digger on the site. This transport is done on your own account and you do not need an operator’s licence.

Example 5 - The digger is owned by the building company, having used the digger you take it from one site to another site (where the digger is stored). This transport is done on your own account and you do not need an operator’s licence.

Example 6 - The digger is not owned by you, you collect it from a depot and deposit it at a site where another company uses it. If you are rewarded for this work in any way (payment or in kind) this is hire or reward, you have not under taken this work on your own account, you have made a pure freight journey – and you will therefore need an operator’s licence.

[Dave_L]

Ah thats much clearer, cheers Mick

[Nigel Walker]

After 13 years of using Transit Tippers i am now fully converted to a Landrover Discovery with an ifor Williams trailer.
Previously I could only legally carry 1.1 ton on the tipper
Now I can tow 3.5 ton legally with the Disco. My trailer is rated to carry 2.7 ton and weighs 600 kgs. So now I collect 2.7 ton from the quarry
in one trip whereas this used to be 3 trips with the tipper. The saving on time has been massive. Also means I can unhitch the trailer and use the disco on its own.
The Disco is classed as a commercial vehicle as it is a special edition with no seats in back and a bulk head.
Best thing I have bought ! I can now understand why all these landrover drivers are so passionate !

I just transport for my own jobs and not hire and reward so I am ok

[GB_Groundworks]

Reading that mick, it suggests I could buy a 6.3 tonner and not require a tacho?

youd be fine for your work, but when delivering the crushers you'd need to use a tacho

[GB_Groundworks]

we had the kx016-4 and breaker on the trailer behind the 7.5 ton today with 3.5 ton of dtp1 on gross train weight must have been 9000kg+ my foreman is class 1 though

tows like its not there

[mickg]

I take it you had the steel drop side tipper Nigel and not the aluminium which is rated to carry just over 1800kg

I was going down the route of a disco Nigel as the MAM is higher but I felt its a one job item where as with a pickup you can carry stone, sand or a tracked dumper on the back and you can still tow the digger on a trailer

[mickg]

how can that make any difference Giles, its the MAM of the vehicle not what licence you hold, I used to have my class 2 but I still could not go over any weight limit and be legal if stopped ?