Sealing in the rain... - To panic or not to panic

[Markyb7]

Hi all...

I recently (8 weeks) ago, laid a 40m2 Imported Indian Raj Green Sandstone patio bordered with a Limestone Tandor cobble. Client and I were very pleased with result.

Said client then surprised me by asking for it to be sealed and specifically requested a wet look as she loves the way it looks when wet and not so keen when dry.

After looking around at a few options I decided to use Kingfisher K Seal.

Patio all cleaned and pressure-washed.

Waited for a dry spell to ensure everything as dry as possible.

Applied coat of K Seal taking care not to leave any pools that could cause a colour discrepancy.

Drinking cup of tea with client who was practically purring over her wet look patio and arranging time to pop back and apply second coat.... when out of the clear blue sky, without warning, the heavens absolutely and biblically opened on me.... And my still wet K-seal.

This was completely out the blue, not forecast and I had no time or way of erecting anything to protect the work.

Being one who studiously reads all instructions I am now panicking that the part where it said "do not apply if rain is imminent" will mean that when I return in the morning I will be faced with an unholy mess...

I am also fearful that runoff will have leached into flower-beds....

Help ! What can I expect to see and what do I need to do in order to put it right ?

Many thanks
Mark

[RAPressureWashing]

Uploads some photos when you have seen the paving.
It might well be ruined I'm afraid if it rained that bad, so soon after sealing.

[Tony McC]

It depends on how far intoi the initial cure you;d got, the intensity and the duration of the rain, and the residual moisture content of the stone prior to sealing.

I've seen disasters where there was nothing more than a short sharp shaower, but I've also seen perfectly fine seal job where they endured 10 mins of steady rain immediately following application.

As Roger says, have a look and upload photies (or send 'em to me)

[Markyb7]

Just been to site and its not pretty. Will work out how to add pictures....

Rain was two hours of heavy drizzle and sealant was only down minutes not hours.

Slabs have gone 'milky'... Client having kittens !!

Have spoken to very helpful guy at Kingfisher, the sealant manufacturer who has suggested I try their 'Solvent No2'. He says that there is a 'possibility' that simply rolling this on may re-activate the solvent and cure the problem.

If this is not sucessful he then suggests mopping the solvent on using disposable mops... Then pressure washing and leaving to over-winter.

I would imagine this will be a horrendously labour intensive process...

[RAPressureWashing]

The guy from the sealer company could be right but I don't know this brand of sealer, is it an acrylic or a PU sealer? if it is acrylic then you should be able to get rid of the "milky" stuff with xylene thinners so the solvent he is talking about is just this. It will be repairable though.

[Markyb7]

Hi... hope I have uploaded these correctly...










Found out today that this is definitely an Acrylic based product.

Supplier suggested I sample try a second coat with the product in an inconspicuous area.

Manufacturer suggested I try the solvent in the same way, so provided it remains dry.... am thinking I will try one of each on adjacent slabs in one the more out of the way areas....

I don't think I've ever been this nervous on a job. I haven't been paid yet and am literally dropping bricks.

Any other suggestions or hand holding would be greatly appreciated..

M



Edited By Tony McC on 1380266055

[RAPressureWashing]

Hi... hope I have uploaded these correctly...

[IMG]http://i781.photobucket.com/albums....MG]

[IMG]http://i781.photobucket.com/albums....MG]

[IMG]http://i781.photobucket.com/albums....MG]

[IMG]http://i781.photobucket.com/albums....MG]


Found out today that this is definitely an Acrylic based product.

Supplier suggested I sample try a second coat with the product in an inconspicuous area.

Manufacturer suggested I try the solvent in the same way, so provided it remains dry.... am thinking I will try one of each on adjacent slabs in one the more out of the way areas....

I don't think I've ever been this nervous on a job. I haven't been paid yet and am literally dropping bricks.

Any other suggestions or hand holding would be greatly appreciated..

M

Mark

If you want to give me a call I'll talk you through a way that should fix this, I'll pm you my number, as I'll be on site from about 09:00 and will have phone with me.

[Tony McC]

I corrected the code you used to post images, but the urls used are incorrect.

Here are the images you sent to me....






I can't see what a second coat would achieve. K-Seal is a good, if blousy, product and I can only imagine they are thinking a second coat would partially dissolve the existing and allow it to re-set without the pebble-dash look.

That may work with very light damage, but from the two photies I've seen, it's not possible to definitively tell whether this is such a case. The solvent idea is more or less the same principle, but more likely to work.

And while we're here, read up on random layouts and the heinous crime that is crossed joints on this page

[Markyb7]

Hi,

Apologies... I thought I had posted this update the other day but must have got lost along the way somewhere ?

Returned to site and tried the Kingfisher Solvent #2 which as Roger (R&A Pressure washing) suspected turns out to be Xylene. Applied and agitated with Nylon brush as recommended by Roger and results very positive ! Milky speckled, flaking "skin" disappeared very quickly and colour returned to slabs much to my (and customers) relief.

Applying a second coat of K Seal 'sort of worked' (Tony you were right) and glad I only tried it in small area... much better results from one careful and even coat of Solvent. Just waiting for a window of weather to get a further coat of K Seal down, but think I may well be into next year now....

In hindsight, really regret going down the "Sealer" rather than "Impregnator" route but product does give customer the look they told me they wanted... (or would have done if not for the weather).

I have read and absorbed and duly chastised about joints but wonder if there is any technical reason for joint layout or is it purely aesthetics ?

Will PM you privately about getting a signed copy of your book Tony.

Thanks to both of you for your help.. I haven't panicked this much on a job in a long long time.

Rgs
Mark

[lutonlagerlout]

the cross on paving draws your eye to it mark and structurally its not right as you have 2 straight joints intersecting
however its unlikely to fail
the boss (tony mc) can do fully random layouts for the price of a few pints
design
myself and most others on here have used them and it takes the pressure off ordering and laying

all the best
LLL

[RAPressureWashing]

Hi,

Apologies... I thought I had posted this update the other day but must have got lost along the way somewhere ?

Returned to site and tried the Kingfisher Solvent #2 which as Roger (R&A Pressure washing) suspected turns out to be Xylene. Applied and agitated with Nylon brush as recommended by Roger and results very positive ! Milky speckled, flaking "skin" disappeared very quickly and colour returned to slabs much to my (and customers) relief.

Applying a second coat of K Seal 'sort of worked' (Tony you were right) and glad I only tried it in small area... much better results from one careful and even coat of Solvent. Just waiting for a window of weather to get a further coat of K Seal down, but think I may well be into next year now....

In hindsight, really regret going down the "Sealer" rather than "Impregnator" route but product does give customer the look they told me they wanted... (or would have done if not for the weather).

I have read and absorbed and duly chastised about joints but wonder if there is any technical reason for joint layout or is it purely aesthetics ?

Will PM you privately about getting a signed copy of your book Tony.

Thanks to both of you for your help.. I haven't panicked this much on a job in a long long time.

Rgs
Mark

Glad it all worked out for you Mark.
The Xylene trick is a good one to know about, will only work with Acrylics not PU's
I'd leave trying to re-coat now until spring next year, also let's the winter throw it's worst at the paving to see how the sealer holds up. If all is ok, then a light clean, allow to dry then re-coat weather permitting :;):