Pavestone black kadapha, few questions

[k13wjd]

Right, i ( we ) have picked our paving. pavestone do a 20.7 m2 pack of black limestone, £380+vat.
i have 16m2 to cover, so leaves some good spare/allows for keeping random etc.

http://www.pavestone.co.uk/natural-stone-products/5/6

quite happy that it will weather in, so thats all good.

done the calcs, going to order
2 bulk bags of type 1 for a sub base around 60mm,
3 tonnes of grit sand, 1t for the mortor bed, 2t for a 50mm base for fake grass.

bags to be delivered onto pallets at my request, as its easier to use a pallet truck to get the pallet to my gate, than barrow 5 ton of you know what.

10 bags of 25kg OPC - i've based it on a 6/1 bedding mix with grit sand, about right ?? I'll likely have it on the wet side, 10mm joints.

my good mate at the local hire shop is doing me a 240v mixer and a 350mm petrol plate for £20 a week.

All in, i count just over £600 ( £37.5/m2)

Sound about right ?

[Pablo]

Hi mate your base is too thin and needs to be 100mm at least so you're going to need 3 bags of type 1. A bag normally weighs about 750-800kg so you're about right for the sand in the bedding. I like to add a taste of plasticiser to the mix it helps adhesion and workability and don't forget you need a saw and a plate too as well as sand and cement for pointing.

[Pablo]

Forgot to add that the black is very very easily stained by mortar and acid cannot be used to clean it so keep your hose and brush handy and clean it every few flags. Even dirty water from cleaning it with a sponge will stain so be careful.

[k13wjd]

sub base or laying base ?My current ground is pretty solid stuff( i can stand on a spade on it, and it doesn't budge) and its going to see fairly light use.

i seem to have a small confusion about gritsand, granite sand, and whinstone grit. i presume there is regional variation depending on what rock is used to make the acutal sand, henve the whinshon grit. Sharp sand is what i'll be using for the mortar, the bedding, and making the compacted base for my fake grass.

[lutonlagerlout]

you only need a wacker for a half hour but heavier the better
needs to be around 80kg plus,the 350 width means nothing if it only weighs 40 kg
LLL

[k13wjd]

complicated.

16.5m of paving, but another 50 odd m2 of fake grass going in, which needs a compacted 50mm deep bed of grit sand.

I have the option of loads of different plates, but it just depends what he has when i need to do the work. massive tool hire place, but i also need to get it in the car.


ground is pretty solid already to be honest, i'm only sticking this type 1 in for drainage, and got get my fall right ( 1:60 fall in the base, stone level)

while im getting answers, as a noob, best to go for a fairly dry mix, or go wet ?



Pablo, when you say its easily stained, anything i can do to make that less likely ?? a coating? as for a saw, i think i only need to make 3 cuts, so thats handy !


as for pointing, i've not gone that far yet. pack it with 10/1 dry mix, or use a pre mixed pointing compound ?


Oh, and should stick a weed membrane down under the type 1. weeds are brutal in my area. And i mean BRUTAL

[r896neo]

No need for a membrane as only maretail or knotweed will make it through compacted sub-base and a membrane won;t stop them anyway.

As for pointing your way to lean on cement there, more like 3 or 4:1. Personally i prefer to use plastering sand and probably better on yours as it stains a little less than building sand but others may have other opinions.

You may be better with a compound as mortar dyes don;t last but the colour of polymerics should. standard grey mortar on black limestone looks awful in my opinion

Mix wise a little stiffer than brick laying mortar with a decent amount of plasticiser, follow the instructions on the bottle but go with the highest figure.

[Pablo]

what part of Scotland are you in I may be able to sort some artificial turf for you at a decent price.

[lutonlagerlout]

neo polymerics are worthless IME
epoxy mortars are the kiddy but you pay well for them
if you can get a plate in your car it will probably be worthless
i can hire one legit from friday to monday dropped off and picked up for £28
that weighs 86kg
why bother picking it up and getting crap in your motor?
LLL ???

[k13wjd]

im in west lothian.

I'm getting fairly decent grade fake grass at £20 m2 - its like 40mm pile, with a twin tone.

My local tool hire guy is a personal mate, and is very local. who do you get the 86kg puppy from.

Most of the digging out was done today, shale is a fecking pain in the arse. i'll compact the shale first, as it'll drop a good few mm. after i can get my levels right.

as for membrane, i've already bought it, so its going in. and on the other garden i've got a 25m2 border getting filled with japanese pebble, so it'll be needed there.

as for pointing, i'm tempted to go dark grey.....not priced epoxy yet.

Main area is just about level, pathway is at gradient that is pre-existing througout my garden.

Ordering the stone in the morning, along with the T1 and gritsand.

[London Stone Paving]

Forgot to add that the black is very very easily stained by mortar and acid cannot be used to clean it so keep your hose and brush handy and clean it every few flags. Even dirty water from cleaning it with a sponge will stain so be careful.

Thats good advice.

[lutonlagerlout]

local tool hire place in dunstable
i have mates that work for other firms and they generally swing by if i need a favour and drop it off
anyway you need a heavy plater
good luck
LLL

[k13wjd]

just looked at the site, they have a 56kg plate at 350mm, or a 70kg 450mm plate. handy as i'm working with a 900 wide path.

No way i can lift a 70kg machine into my boot, need to get that dropped off. i also need the plate to compress 50mm of gritsand to lay fake grass...

Also hiring a mixer off them, but not until this base is ready, flat, and rock solid.

[Pablo]

You'd be much better off using a wider plate on the gritsand for the lawn skinny plates are a b#llocks in sand. I could've saved you a fiver a m2 but seen as you're a sassenach and I'm originally from Skye you can go swivel.

[r896neo]

Sorry when i said polymerics i meant the two part type are they called epoxy mortars? I used rompox easy a few times on indian stone but after the chat on here am steering clear of it now and have been using rompox d1.

The colour has been a big draw for me on some jobs where sand and cement would detract from the paving. Plus putting it on
in the rain is great.