Natural stone slabs lift off bedding - Concerns over quality

[Garden16]

Hi - I have/am having similar issues as those described by Rugbydan1977. In short, Contractor 1 was unprofessional and did poor quality work, so we went our separate ways (lots of rubbish left all over property, over-filled skip on road, unfinished patio etc.). Contractor 2 started ok but has become unprofessional, has seemingly lost interest and I am concerned about his work on the patio (we have not paid him anything yet unlike the first lot).

Contractor 2 started off sounding good and was highly critical of the work that had been started on the patio. He pointed out various issues and explained that he should not be able to lift the slabs up off the bedding by hand, which he could.

The slabs were lifted up, undamaged, and put to one side, the bedding was removed. Some days later, one of his men started laying slabs back down, he used a line, spirit levels and a wet mix. The next day, the slabs he laid were solid. The team didn't come back when they said they would.

The guy that laid the slabs was no longer available so the head guy of Contractor 2 (who we were dealing with) came over for an hour to lay some more. The mix he used was completely different, dry and reddish, the slabs were laid down and tapped in but the bedding was quite dry. Some areas actually were wet, had gaps underneath and have set solid, other areas are dry and we can lift the slabs out by hand. He used more water for these areas that are now solid, but he stopped asking for it and carried on with a drier mix. So there are essentially three different bed types under half a modest sized patio.

So he has left the slabs in the same condition he found them when he was so critical - the slabs can be lifted by hand.
I am so frustrated that we seem to be being taken advantage of again and I don't have any trust left in him to finish the job correctly.

So here's my question: Is this a recognized technique to lay slabs on this drier, sandier bed, leaving the slabs loose? He said he would add water later which would allow the cement to bind it. I don't like how it is panning out but it would be useful to know if this does sound poor or whether he may have a particular method that produces good results. If I know, it will help with the difficult conversations ahead, especially when we ask him to explain why the work has been done in such a way so far.

Apologies for the lengthy explanation, but this is the much edited version of recent events and I'm really tired of it, upset, poorer and my daughter is still without a safe garden to enjoy this summer. Just don't want to be taken advantage of again and want my garden back.

[GB_Groundworks]

He's talking bollocks, should be laid on a full bed of wet but stiff cement and gritsand mix, I add a little sbr to my mix as well. But it is trowel-able and bound together I'm struggling for an analogy, a bit like a cake mix I guess coats the back of the spoon. Cement requires plenty of water to trigger the chemical reaction.

We should do a video of a good paving mix to aid in describing it to ppl ill video the next batch I knock up.

Where abouts are you? Is he using fine building sand?



Edited By GB_Groundworks on 1465946260

[Garden16]

Hi and many thanks for the response.

Yes, my instinct is telling me the same. We are in South Birmingham.
I'm not sure exactly what he is using but I've just popped out, lifted up a slab and crumbled the edges of the bed away with my hands (it's brown with a reddish hue). The first section that went down was a good wet mix, to my untrained eyes it looked right, and was a dark grey colour. Those slabs are firmly fixed in place. It's the rest that is completely different.

It's a shame as it's beautiful stone (carbon black, hand-cut, ethically-sourced, limestone from naturalpaving.co.uk). Wasted a fair amount already and will have to lift up some more. He has completed some work so I will ask for an invoice for just that. Any assurances he gives about completing the work won't mean much to me now as that trust has gone.

I appreciate all the good guys will be booked solid throughout summer, most likely. So hopefully we can ask one of them to pop over and take a look and maybe schedule something in for later in the year.

A video would be really useful. Can't believe it's happened twice!
Thanks again.

[GB_Groundworks]

A couple of the lads on here are round your way

[Garden16]

Thanks - via Interlay, I have found someone who is popping over tonight to take a look.

We asked for an invoice for the work completed and, as expected, we are not seeing eye-to-eye with them. It is too much for what they have actually done (in our opinion).

I have searched the forum for topics about disputing invoices, but I didn't see anything. So apologies if this is the wrong place to post this, but it would be good to get some guidance on how best to go about it.

We were promised a written quote at the start but we never got one. We did ask again. We had arranged for the Contractor to see us yesterday to bring the paperwork. He arrived but had 'forgotten' the paperwork. We said we could only carry on discussion if we got something in writing so he went home to get it. He didn't come back or contact us to let us know what was going on (apparently he came back while we were out, but he didn't put anything through the letter box, email, call, text us about this - we had to chase him up).

We only have a verbal agreement of a list of jobs and a final figure. They are not a member of the ADR Group or any other trade bodies (I know, I am cringing typing this, but we had our reasons for wanting to get something started quickly).

We will go back to them with what we think is reasonable, but any tips for next steps if they reject this? We want to move on, have their equipment removed and not pay anymore than we should be. I appreciate this may not be the place to ask, but I thought I'd try - won't be offended if this is out of scope